There is a distinction there though. I think the businessman has the right to discriminate based on the product, not on the customer. Is it discriminatory for a Jewish baker to refuse to make a swastika cake? He's refusing the cake, not the person. if the same Nazi just wants regular buttercream, he can't deny him based on his religious beliefs.

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His mind is not for rent to any God or government.

I've answered this like 4 times already.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

You've been Brick'd!

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Hawaii (fuck) You

You're not answering it in a way that will stand up to legal scrutiny, only with your arbitrary opinion on what is "racist" or "bad" or whatever. The fact is you want to force people to make products they do not agree with philosophically. There's a world of difference between that and denying a person service because of their skin color or religious beliefs.

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His mind is not for rent to any God or government.

They can set their own standards. See my example of the burger place for clarification.

There is very little difference between racial discrimination and sexual orientation discrimination and I would hope everyone agrees.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

So if a Bakery makes a baby cake for gender reveals do they also have to make a strawberry shortcake for its an aborted mess? Not doing so would be discriminatory.

I'm not suggesting anyone should be allowed to discriminate based on sexual orientation. If you hang out a shingle and a gay couple comes in, you can't deny them your product or service. But when we're talking about custom work, I think the seller has some rights concerning what he will produce.

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His mind is not for rent to any God or government.

I discriminate all the time against corporations that do not have 30 days or less payment terms.

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If our society had any sort of decency you wouldn't need to think like that. But everyone wants to focus on obscure exceptions rather than deal with the reality of routine discrimination.


I am sure there is some racist asshole who wants a Black owned bakery to make a cake showing a lynching. And maybe there are radical abortion rights people that so celebrate the discarded fetus that they would ask a religious oriented nun run bakery to make a cake of a formerly pregnant woman with red jam squirting out between her legs. But that stuff is so absurd. Turd.

Let's not be blinded by such nonsense in a way that allows us to discriminate against two men wanting flowers for their legal wedding.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Of course they do and I stated the criteria in which denying service is acceptable.

Anything else is obfuscation of the clear and concise criteria.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Okay.

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His mind is not for rent to any God or government.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Dennis, your unwillingness or inability to answer questions doesn't make them irrelevant just because you say so.

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Now, do you believe that or do you know that?

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

I've been told there is one God by his Son. So I both know and believe that.

You don't have to if you choose to do otherwise.

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It's true. No one has brought up an example that doesn't fit easily in it. Aborted babies!

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

That's because we can't be sure that the Honorable Judge Boilermaker Rick will be sitting on the bench when Nazi Pete sues Shlomo the Baker for religious discrimination because he wouldn't make an Iron Cross cake to celebrate Hitler's birthday.

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His mind is not for rent to any God or government.

You are truly an odd person. I give long winded responses to damn near everything thrown at me. If I seem unwilling or unable to answer a question, it is simply because I do not know the answer with any degree of certainty. And when it comes to God, I am quite open in saying I don't have the answers, only beliefs. Let me give you some gaps in my knowledge base:

-Sports history/trivia,
-Music and Hollywood,
-Religion,
-Cooking, grilling
-Anything related to art

When you delve into those areas, I freely admit to being an idiot.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

As long he isn't baking other racist cakes he is fine.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Well, isn't this basically similar to your debate with Nas about white people and Muslims? I could be wrong, but I believe the most recent research into the topic indicates homosexuality is genetic and not a choice or belief. If that's the case, it's easy to make the distinction.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

And when Turd asks a question, you call it absurd.

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I agree, but that isn't going to stop a suit like the one I suggested from being filed. And this entire issue is largely religious. In most cases the refusal to perform the requested service is going to be based on religious beliefs.

And again, I don't think you should be able to refuse service to a homosexual simply on the basis of him liking other men. But I don't know that you should be forced to create a product that expresses acceptance of a practice that you don't support, e.g. a cake with two men holding hands. Similarly, you shouldn't be able to withhold your banana muffins from a Muslim woman because you disagree with her wearing a hijab, but I also don't think you should be forced to make a cake that says "Allahu Akbar!"

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His mind is not for rent to any God or government.

Seacrest calling people out for not answering questions.

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I'd say aborted fetus cakes is a text book definition of absurd.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

I'm with JORR on this one. I think it would be illegal for a business to deny a customer a standard cake with Tim and Steve on it instead of Tim and Judy. But once you are asking for a custom creation, that is where things get murky.

My wife once had a caterer refuse to make a menu on account of it being racist. It was a corporate event sponsored by affinity groups within the corporation. The African american group requested a meal of fried chicken, collard greens, and watermelon. Was that discrimination?

It was a joke, yutz.

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

sounds like a setup to me.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

I am nothing if not a yutz. Or a putz.

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The custom cake follows the same criteria.

Of course some custom cakes could be denied without issue. It also helps there is less comparable proof of discrimination. If they had a book of previous cakes with two people holding hands for instance that would be tough to claim it was not sexual orientation discrimination.

However they would be smart not to say 'no gay custom cakes' as the reason.

So just to be clear some of you think sexual orientation discrimination is OK in many circumstances?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Well, not completely ... they didn't ask for grape Flavor Aid.

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George