If that's your standard you have to admit that LeBron is indisputably better than Jordan.

The only edge Isiah truly has is championships.

Isiah played until he was 32 and Stockton played until he was 40. Stockton has more total points, assists, rebounds, steals, blocks, better shooting percentage, free throw percentage, and a better 3 point percentage. If you want to compare Stockton's numbers over his best 13 seasons to those of Isiah's, it wouldn't help your argument either. The only edge Isiah truly has is championships. Isiah stole 2 when the Lakers, Celtics, and Sixers were declining and Jordan was playing alone. He also needed an all star team to do that.

Stockton absolutely destroys Isiah and nearly every other player in NBA history if we start to look at the analytics/advanced stats. Stockton is 3rd in value over replacement. Isiah doesn't even crack the top 55.

The only edge Isiah truly has is championships.

Whenever best PG conversations are being discussed by their peers, Stockton and Magic are generally called the best for a reason.

Yeah, because Stockton and Magic are "nice guys" and Isiah is a prick.

Do you think Jason Kidd, Gary Payton, and others care about that?

Of course they care. They probably hate Isiah more than you do.

Yes, I have no love for Captain Hook and those Pistons teams. They made a young Nas cry more than once. MJ and Kobe were world-class assholes, but they're still beloved by their peers. Why? They weren't weasels.

Yes, I have no love for Captain Hook and those Pistons teams. They made a young Nas cry more than once. MJ and Kobe were world-class assholes, but they're still beloved by their peers. Why? They weren't weasels.

Yes, NBA players love them and want to be like them. If Isiah died tomorrow, who would cry?

Like Hyman Roth, Jordan has made all of his partners rich. Isiah can't say the same. I would give my money to Jordan.

Great point.


Nah his edge was in that he was simply a better player. He was a dominant point guard whereas Stockton was not. And in the era in which Isiah was dominating Stockton was an afterthought. Even though they were the same age. Couldn't even sniff the Conference Finals (let alone NBA Finals) when you had the sort of "great teams" that Isiah had to compete against.

Of course they care. They probably hate Isiah more than you do.

Stockton was putting up better numbers when Isiah stole a couple of championships with his all star team. Isiah's all star team didn't face the peak Lakers, Celtics, Sixers, or Bulls.

88-89
Stockton- 17.1 ppg 13.8 assists 3.2 stls 54% fg
Isiah- 18.2 ppg 8.3 assists 1.7 stls 46% fg
89-90
Stockton- 17.2 ppg 14.5 assists 2.7 stls 51% fg
Isiah- 18.4 ppg 9.4 assists 1.7 stls 43% fg
90-91
Stockton- 17.2 ppg 14.2 assists 2.9 stls 50% fg
Isiah- 16.2 ppg 9.3 assists 1.6 stls 43% fg

Yes, I have no love for Captain Hook and those Pistons teams. They made a young Nas cry more than once. MJ and Kobe were world-class assholes, but they're still beloved by their peers. Why? They weren't weasels.

It's ridiculous to suggest past or present players like Isiah more. After failing in the CBA multiple times, Indiana, Toronto, and New York no one wants to touch Isiah. The owners went out of their way to make Jordan a partner. Players blow Jordan so they can be apart of his brand. Isiah blows LeBron so he can get love from LeBron's stans because he's bitter. Just like Scottie.

Just because people respect Jordan the player doesn't mean they like him as a person. He has nowhere near the relationship with guys in the league that Isiah has.

And it's ridiculous to think just because the owners can exploit Jordan and make money off him that they particularly like him as person

Jordan adds value to the NBA community. Captain Hook adds bitterness. That's why he's an owner and Isiah is cleaning the studio for some NBA show.

Jordan adds value to the NBA community.