Chicago Fanatics Message Board :: View topic - Carmelo Mother effing Anthony

I want to know Carmelo's opinion on all this snitchin

But I thought you could just give him the ball and get out of the damn way?

Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too.

He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade.

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

You aren't going to get much for him at this stage of his career. You will get someone else's junk. The Knicks should have simply let hIm roll a few years ago. There weren't any good sign and trades on the table.

Signing him led to the disastrous signing of guys like Noah. Jackson is too old and too arrogant to ever utter the term rebuild so he will probably never do it. He is also too lazy to actually scout college players full time either.

Signing Anthony was stupid.

long time guy wrote:

WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure.

long time guy wrote:

WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure.

long time guy wrote:

WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure.

Seacrest wrote:

long time guy wrote:

WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure.

Vindicates Krause to a large degree.

long time guy wrote:

Seacrest wrote:

long time guy wrote:

WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:

long time guy wrote:

Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure.

Vindicates Krause to a large degree.

To the nth degree.

Phil was incredibly shitty to him.

Phil Jackson was a snake that backdoored Doug Collins to get his job. Cultivated relationships with Jordan and other key players and leveraged it to get Collins job.

He also was instrumental in the divisiveness between players and Krause. I wasn't the biggest Krause fan but Cartwright swore by him. Cartwright is an honorable man

Yeah I also wish I could have undone the Phil Jackson era in Chicago.

How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain.

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them.

veganfan21 wrote:

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius.

The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team.

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

I said Jordan and the players know more than you. I guess you disagree. Pippen and Jordan were on the team when Collins was there. As was Grant. Please tell us why you disagree with Kobe, Shaq, and Jordan on the connection between Jackson and those 11 rings.

veganfan21 wrote:

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

Did you watch the Bulls during Collins years? If so please provide an explanation as to why they didn't win.

veganfan21 wrote:

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

long time guy wrote:

veganfan21 wrote:

Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations.
The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

That's pretty pompous to start. I'm pretty sure I'm older than you and have followed the Bulls from Norm to Artis to Reggie to MJ on. Phil was critical to the Bull's and also the Lakers success. He may be a horrible GM but that has nothing to do with his coaching in that era.

Yes that's definitely looking at it with hindsight.

Under Collins, Jordan was not buying into anything other than "Michael and the Jordanaires".

For whatever reason, Phil got him to believe in his teammates. Maybe it would've eventually happened with Collins as well but we'll never know. I do doubt it because as I said Doug was gonna burn himself out. He couldn't keep an even keel.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Fri Apr 14, 2017 2:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
ToxicMasculinity wrote: I want to know Carmelo's opinion on all this snitchin Carmelo should shut up and enjoy the $120M he opted to accept. Decisions like that have consequences.

Author:	Brick [ Fri Apr 14, 2017 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
But I thought you could just give him the ball and get out of the damn way?

Author:	long time guy [ Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Boilermaker Rick wrote: But I thought you could just give him the ball and get out of the damn way? Only after giving it to Etwaun Moore buckets!

Author:	long time guy [ Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade.

Author:	WaitingforRuffcorn [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:02 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move.

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Author:	veganfan21 [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote: long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move. Ehh I think there was cause for letting him walk in order to start fresh. In retrospect what they should have done is a sign and trade. PJ is the new Billy King of GMs - old, expensive roster with no tradeable assets (well, except Porzingis) and you're not even in the playoffs.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 11:59 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote: long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move. You aren't going to get much for him at this stage of his career. You will get someone else's junk. The Knicks should have simply let hIm roll a few years ago. There weren't any good sign and trades on the table. Signing him led to the disastrous signing of guys like Noah. Jackson is too old and too arrogant to ever utter the term rebuild so he will probably never do it. He is also too lazy to actually scout college players full time either. Signing Anthony was stupid.

Author:	Seacrest [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: WaitingforRuffcorn wrote: long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move. You aren't going to get much for him at this stage of his career. You will get someone else's junk. The Knicks should have simply let hIm roll a few years ago. There weren't any good sign and trades on the table. Signing him led to the disastrous signing of guys like Noah. Jackson is too old and too arrogant to ever utter the term rebuild so he will probably never do it. He is also too lazy to actually scout college players full time either. Signing Anthony was stupid. Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Seacrest wrote: long time guy wrote: WaitingforRuffcorn wrote: long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move. You aren't going to get much for him at this stage of his career. You will get someone else's junk. The Knicks should have simply let hIm roll a few years ago. There weren't any good sign and trades on the table. Signing him led to the disastrous signing of guys like Noah. Jackson is too old and too arrogant to ever utter the term rebuild so he will probably never do it. He is also too lazy to actually scout college players full time either. Signing Anthony was stupid. Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure. Vindicates Krause to a large degree.

Author:	Seacrest [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: Seacrest wrote: long time guy wrote: WaitingforRuffcorn wrote: long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move. You aren't going to get much for him at this stage of his career. You will get someone else's junk. The Knicks should have simply let hIm roll a few years ago. There weren't any good sign and trades on the table. Signing him led to the disastrous signing of guys like Noah. Jackson is too old and too arrogant to ever utter the term rebuild so he will probably never do it. He is also too lazy to actually scout college players full time either. Signing Anthony was stupid. Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure. Vindicates Krause to a large degree. To the nth degree. Phil was incredibly shitty to him.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Seacrest wrote: long time guy wrote: Seacrest wrote: long time guy wrote: WaitingforRuffcorn wrote: long time guy wrote: Phil is a fool and is in way over his skies as GM. From inept coaching hires to giving Melo the bread he has made one bonehead move after another. Noah signing was stupid too. He is now scapegoating Melo when he should never hAve signed him in the first place. Should have let him walk and rebuilt from there. No one is taking on that salary at his age. If they do they aren't going to give you anything in a trade. Someone will take him, and letting him walk would have been a dumb move. You aren't going to get much for him at this stage of his career. You will get someone else's junk. The Knicks should have simply let hIm roll a few years ago. There weren't any good sign and trades on the table. Signing him led to the disastrous signing of guys like Noah. Jackson is too old and too arrogant to ever utter the term rebuild so he will probably never do it. He is also too lazy to actually scout college players full time either. Signing Anthony was stupid. Jerry Krause continues to enjoy this I'm sure. Vindicates Krause to a large degree. To the nth degree. Phil was incredibly shitty to him. He was definitely universally disliked for a reason.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Phil Jackson was a snake that backdoored Doug Collins to get his job. Cultivated relationships with Jordan and other key players and leveraged it to get Collins job. He also was instrumental in the divisiveness between players and Krause. I wasn't the biggest Krause fan but Cartwright swore by him. Cartwright is an honorable man

Author:	Seacrest [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: Phil Jackson was a snake that backdoored Doug Collins to get his job. Cultivated relationships with Jordan and other key players and leveraged it to get Collins job. He also was instrumental in the divisiveness between players and Krause. I wasn't the biggest Krause fan but Cartwright swore by him. Cartwright is an honorable man This. The list of people that disliked Krause is not a long one.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Yeah I also wish I could have undone the Phil Jackson era in Chicago.

Author:	Douchebag [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 11:46 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
I once bumped into Doug Collins at an airport in Cancun. I'm waiting in the security line and there he is standing right in front of me. My former mother in law nudges my father in law and says, "Look, isn't that Phil Jackson?!?". Doug's wife was also there and overheard the entire conversation. She cracks up, and Doug looks like he wanted to murder somebody. I still think he's bitter from the Bulls years.

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Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:59 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
veganfan21 wrote: Yeah I also wish I could have undone the Phil Jackson era in Chicago. Not about that. Krause had more to do with it than he did.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:38 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them. I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius. The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them. I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius. The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team. I said Jordan and the players know more than you. I guess you disagree. Pippen and Jordan were on the team when Collins was there. As was Grant. Please tell us why you disagree with Kobe, Shaq, and Jordan on the connection between Jackson and those 11 rings.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 4:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them. I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius. The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team. I said Jordan and the players know more than you. I guess you disagree. Pippen and Jordan were on the team when Collins was there. As was Grant. Please tell us why you disagree with Kobe, Shaq, and Jordan on the connection between Jackson and those 11 rings. Did you watch the Bulls during Collins years? If so please provide an explanation as to why they didn't win.

Author:	Terry's Peeps [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 5:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them. I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius. The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team. I said Jordan and the players know more than you. I guess you disagree. Pippen and Jordan were on the team when Collins was there. As was Grant. Please tell us why you disagree with Kobe, Shaq, and Jordan on the connection between Jackson and those 11 rings. Did you watch the Bulls during Collins years? If so please provide an explanation as to why they didn't win. Doug Collins is why they didn't win. He was a manic coach who rode the roller coaster of emotions and it hurt the team. Phil Jackson was able to be a steadying influence in addition to developing Scottie Pippen as a star.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
That's revisionist. The Bulls weren't ready to win when he was coach. Grant Pippen were only a couple of years in and Pippen already had been injured. Collins got everything he could out of what he had to work with.

Author:	Terry's Peeps [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Yes that's definitely looking at it with hindsight. Under Collins, Jordan was not buying into anything other than "Michael and the Jordanaires". For whatever reason, Phil got him to believe in his teammates. Maybe it would've eventually happened with Collins as well but we'll never know. I do doubt it because as I said Doug was gonna burn himself out. He couldn't keep an even keel.

Author:	Zippy-The-Pinhead [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them. I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius. The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team. That's pretty pompous to start. I'm pretty sure I'm older than you and have followed the Bulls from Norm to Artis to Reggie to MJ on. Phil was critical to the Bull's and also the Lakers success. He may be a horrible GM but that has nothing to do with his coaching in that era.

Author:	long time guy [ Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Carmelo Mother effing Anthony
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: long time guy wrote: veganfan21 wrote: How can I forget how influential Krause's triangle offense was in both Chicago and LA. 11 rings is no joke. He was also instrumental in forging peace between Kobe and Shaq, and between Rodman and Rodman's brain. Phil Jackson walked into a team that was ready to win in both situations. The Rodman stuff is overblown. Rodman was an ass with the Bulls but they won which obscures everything. So why did Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, and Shaq have a combined zero rings before Jackson walked into their lives. And why do they each give credit to Jackson in copious interviews and self-authored books? I guess you know better than them. I'm fairly confident than I know more than you. I watched that team from the very beginning. Phil Jackson is one of the biggest frauds going and I'm glad to see that you're a big fan. Had the benefit of coaching 3 of arguably the top 10 12 guys in history and somehow he is a genius. The reason that Jordan had no rings is because he didn't have anyone around him during those years. Doug did a helluva job coaching that team. That's pretty pompous to start. I'm pretty sure I'm older than you and have followed the Bulls from Norm to Artis to Reggie to MJ on. Phil was critical to the Bull's and also the Lakers success. He may be a horrible GM but that has nothing to do with his coaching in that era. You have to define what critical happens to be. Doug Collins coached the Bulls when they were a crap team. They had Jordan and nothing else. He led them to an upset of a Cleveland team that was much better. Phil Jackson didn't lead Jordan to trust his teammates Krause provided him with better teammates. When you look at the 4 people most instrumental to the Bulls success Jordan Pippen Krause and Jackson Jackson had the least impact. It was not difficult to coach Michael Jordan and this notion that the Bulls won because Jackson changed Jordans thinking is garbage. Jordan had terrible teammates early in his career and he had to dominate the ball in order for the Bulls to win. The guys he won with in 91 were nothing like the guys he won with in 87 or 88. Look at the rosters and you'll see what I'm talking about. The Bulls took off once Pippen and Grant became reliable players. Pippen becoming an all star.