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Trading Sale
http://chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=103206
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Author:  Brick [ Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

312player wrote:
Hank Scorpio wrote:
Yeah, I don't care about the Chapman trade at all. They won. It was worth it.




Won Castro trade too. Cashman ain't scared to play poker with Theo, why is Herry~Kenny?
http://chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=99603&start=30

You didn't seem so impressed with the Yankees just a little bit ago.

Author:  312player [ Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

I seem pretty consistent, eh? ... The Yanks won't win dick in the next 5 years..they are rebuilding now and The Yanks won the Castro trade.. I didn't gave a problem with overpaying for Chapman, I preferred Miller, still do...I'd let Chapman walk too and find a new closer.

Author:  America [ Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?

Author:  leashyourkids [ Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?


Stockholm Syndrome?

Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Author:  RFDC [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Exactly. I am not sure why the Sox would just automatically eliminate the Cubs. If the Cubs make the best offer then that is what you go with. The goal is to get better, not to please meatball fans who do not like the Cubs.

Author:  good dolphin [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.


wear the 1976 jersey every time he pitches in the crosstown

Author:  Joe Orr Road Rod [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

RFDC wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Exactly. I am not sure why the Sox would just automatically eliminate the Cubs. If the Cubs make the best offer then that is what you go with. The goal is to get better, not to please meatball fans who do not like the Cubs.


I think the reluctance probably goes both ways, although Epstein is teflon after the World Series win. Whoever comes out on the short end of a Cubs/Sox trade is going to have to live with it in his face until the players retire. Cubs fans complain about LeMahieu, can you imagine if the Sox had six or seven years of All-Star performances from Baez and Almora while Sale broke down?

Author:  Nas [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Exactly. I am not sure why the Sox would just automatically eliminate the Cubs. If the Cubs make the best offer then that is what you go with. The goal is to get better, not to please meatball fans who do not like the Cubs.


I think the reluctance probably goes both ways, although Epstein is teflon after the World Series win. Whoever comes out on the short end of a Cubs/Sox trade is going to have to live with it in his face until the players retire. Cubs fans complain about LeMahieu, can you imagine if the Sox had six or seven years of All-Star performances from Baez and Almora while Sale broke down?


I think the trade works for both teams. Sale would give the Cubs an all star rotation for at least 3 years. The Sox would get pieces they can win with almost immediately. Of course the players the Sox get in return will likely play longer.

Author:  Joe Orr Road Rod [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Nas wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Exactly. I am not sure why the Sox would just automatically eliminate the Cubs. If the Cubs make the best offer then that is what you go with. The goal is to get better, not to please meatball fans who do not like the Cubs.


I think the reluctance probably goes both ways, although Epstein is teflon after the World Series win. Whoever comes out on the short end of a Cubs/Sox trade is going to have to live with it in his face until the players retire. Cubs fans complain about LeMahieu, can you imagine if the Sox had six or seven years of All-Star performances from Baez and Almora while Sale broke down?


I think the trade works for both teams. Sale would give the Cubs an all star rotation for at least 3 years. The Sox would get pieces they can win with almost immediately.


Trades rarely work out the way you think they will, especially on both ends. I'm not going into a Sale trade hoping for my best case. If I'm the Sox I have to look at my worst case and think about if I can live with that.

Author:  Nas [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Nas wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Exactly. I am not sure why the Sox would just automatically eliminate the Cubs. If the Cubs make the best offer then that is what you go with. The goal is to get better, not to please meatball fans who do not like the Cubs.


I think the reluctance probably goes both ways, although Epstein is teflon after the World Series win. Whoever comes out on the short end of a Cubs/Sox trade is going to have to live with it in his face until the players retire. Cubs fans complain about LeMahieu, can you imagine if the Sox had six or seven years of All-Star performances from Baez and Almora while Sale broke down?


I think the trade works for both teams. Sale would give the Cubs an all star rotation for at least 3 years. The Sox would get pieces they can win with almost immediately.


Trades rarely work out the way you think they will, especially on both ends. I'm not going into a Sale trade hoping for my best case. If I'm the Sox I have to look at my worst case and think about if I can live with that.


That's why you ask for more from the Cubs. Eliminating them as a trade partner is foolish.

Author:  312player [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.






Exactly, the Cubs are in a great position to pull it off and the Sox could capitalize.. They won't, they'd rather settle for less with a team in another city..they lack confidence and charisma, very insecure front office.

Author:  Brick [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

312player wrote:
Exactly, the Cubs are in a great position to pull it off and the Sox could capitalize.. They won't, they'd rather settle for less with a team in another city..they lack confidence and charisma, very insecure front office.
I don't know why people act like the Cubs are going to offer a great deal for Sale. It's not how they operate.

Outside of the Chapman trade last year they have shown time and time again they aren't willing to give up anyone who is actually any good.

Author:  312player [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

I'd package Schwarber and prospects for Sale, the Sox are up against the clock..when Sale is a FA he's going to Paid over 300 million.. He's essentially a 3 year rental and everyday that value goes down once the season starts.

Author:  America [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

312player wrote:
I'd package Schwarber and prospects for Sale, the Sox are up against the clock..when Sale is a FA he's going to Paid over 300 million.. He's essentially a 3 year rental and everyday that value goes down once the season starts.

"3 year rental"

Author:  Joe Orr Road Rod [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

312player wrote:
I'd package Schwarber and prospects for Sale, the Sox are up against the clock..when Sale is a FA he's going to Paid over 300 million.. He's essentially a 3 year rental and everyday that value goes down once the season starts.



You say that like Schwarber is some kind of "can't miss". He's got a .245 career average over about 300 at-bats. You sound like the fan of any team who wants to trade for a top guy but doesn't want to give up anyone who you really like. Maybe you can mention Vogelbach next. If I'm the Sox I'd want Baez, Almora, and three more good prospects with two of them being pitchers. I'd be looking for a similar deal from anyone.

Author:  Terry's Peeps [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

You don't come out publicly and say you are eliminating a potential trading partner.

It's dumb.

Author:  Kirkwood [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Vogelbach was traded for Montgomery.

Author:  America [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Terry's Peeps wrote:
You don't come out publicly and say you are eliminating a potential trading partner.

It's dumb.

They didnt do that.

Author:  Cashman [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Nas wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
Why on earth would the White Sox want to do anything for the Cubs?
If the Sox trade Sale, they trade him to the team that gives them the best offer. It should not matter if its the Cubs, Tigers, Indians, Cardinals, or A's. The Cubs have the pieces to get Sale if they want him.

Exactly. I am not sure why the Sox would just automatically eliminate the Cubs. If the Cubs make the best offer then that is what you go with. The goal is to get better, not to please meatball fans who do not like the Cubs.


I think the reluctance probably goes both ways, although Epstein is teflon after the World Series win. Whoever comes out on the short end of a Cubs/Sox trade is going to have to live with it in his face until the players retire. Cubs fans complain about LeMahieu, can you imagine if the Sox had six or seven years of All-Star performances from Baez and Almora while Sale broke down?


I think the trade works for both teams. Sale would give the Cubs an all star rotation for at least 3 years. The Sox would get pieces they can win with almost immediately.


Trades rarely work out the way you think they will, especially on both ends. I'm not going into a Sale trade hoping for my best case. If I'm the Sox I have to look at my worst case and think about if I can live with that.




I am in no way wanting to trade Sale, just to trade him. What happens when his contract ends? We get a 1st rd pick? Is that 1st rd pick in 4yrs worth keeping him?

Author:  Joe Orr Road Rod [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Cashman wrote:
I am in no way wanting to trade Sale, just to trade him. What happens when his contract ends? We get a 1st rd pick? Is that 1st rd pick in 4yrs worth keeping him?


Looks like comp picks will be gone with the new CBA.

Author:  Nas [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

We may have been watching Sale lose a half step last year too.

Author:  pittmike [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

It may be a year or two early but I feel this has been the Sox plan all along. Since Hahn "took over" they draft pitchers use them and let them go before they cost too much. So we shouldn't be surprised they would move Sale especially since he seems to have pissed them off.

Author:  Joe Orr Road Rod [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Nas wrote:
We may have been watching Sale lose a half step last year too.



I don't see that. He went along with Coop's dumbfuck idea to "pitch to contact" for about half a season.

Author:  TurdFerguson [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Nas wrote:
We may have been watching Sale lose a half step last year too.



I don't see that. He went along with Coop's dumbfuck idea to "pitch to contact" for about half a season.


Saw and article showing a good chunk off his decline may be related to switching Tyler Flowers to Navarro/Avila. Pretty telling that the sox have 5 starting pitchers on a top 10 list of biggest change in called strikes between 2015 and 2016.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/where-chris-sales-numbers-fell-off-a-cliff/

Also a fun shout out to Sale calling Hahn over winter regarding the non-tender of Flowers. I don't see any way he signs an extension, the problem there is no way to extract his value.

Author:  America [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

pittmike wrote:
It may be a year or two early but I feel this has been the Sox plan all along. Since Hahn "took over" they draft pitchers use them and let them go before they cost too much. So we shouldn't be surprised they would move Sale especially since he seems to have pissed them off.

When have the Sox done that?

Author:  pittmike [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 3:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
It may be a year or two early but I feel this has been the Sox plan all along. Since Hahn "took over" they draft pitchers use them and let them go before they cost too much. So we shouldn't be surprised they would move Sale especially since he seems to have pissed them off.

When have the Sox done that?


They haven't sold off yet because I think it started at or shortly before the Sale pick. They draft mostly college arms since.

Author:  America [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 3:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

This didn't come from the Sox. Hahn didn't go to the media and say "NO CUBS"...its entirely possible the Cubs offered some trash package of Soler/Almora/Happ and the Sox told them to get lost. Then the Cubs told Olney "THE SOX WONT DEAL WITH US, BUTTHURT", but really its just the Cubs aren't willing to part with Schwarber and Baez and without both of them the Sox wont make the deal.

Author:  good dolphin [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 4:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

America wrote:
This didn't come from the Sox. Hahn didn't go to the media and say "NO CUBS"...its entirely possible the Cubs offered some trash package of Soler/Almora/Happ and the Sox told them to get lost. Then the Cubs told Olney "THE SOX WONT DEAL WITH US, BUTTHURT", but really its just the Cubs aren't willing to part with Schwarber and Baez and without both of them the Sox wont make the deal.


both of them and more

Author:  Nas [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trading Sale

good dolphin wrote:
America wrote:
This didn't come from the Sox. Hahn didn't go to the media and say "NO CUBS"...its entirely possible the Cubs offered some trash package of Soler/Almora/Happ and the Sox told them to get lost. Then the Cubs told Olney "THE SOX WONT DEAL WITH US, BUTTHURT", but really its just the Cubs aren't willing to part with Schwarber and Baez and without both of them the Sox wont make the deal.


both of them and more

You're not getting both this year.

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