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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:17 pm 
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Cease and Rutherford maybe? Machado at short, Anderson in center?


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:32 pm 
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MartyD47 wrote:
Cease and Rutherford maybe? Machado at short, Anderson in center?

Not sure if I could watch Anderson try to learn center....


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 12:14 am 
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I wonder who the Sox actually offered....since they seem to have made one.


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:25 am 
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Quote:
Bob Nightengale‏@BNightengale
The #Whitesox not only have made a strong bid for #Orioles 3B Manny Machado, but actually have made the best offer of the dozen offers the Orioles have received


I guess Jerry thinks he can get Manny to sign a team friendly, below market deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:33 am 
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conns7901 wrote:
Quote:
Bob Nightengale‏@BNightengale
The #Whitesox not only have made a strong bid for #Orioles 3B Manny Machado, but actually have made the best offer of the dozen offers the Orioles have received


I guess Jerry thinks he can get Manny to sign a team friendly, below market deal.


Only make this trade if Manny agrees to an extension


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:27 am 
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What a way to get up in the morning.

Without an extension guaranteed I don't think the Sox can give up much. I actually don't mind it as a low-cost rental if it puts them in pole position to extend him next year. He could always be dealt at the deadline for a haul to a team in need.

And hey, even if Rodon is toast there's still a path for this team to contend for the division next year. 1. Moncada 2. Machado 3. Abreu 4. Avi 5. Eloy could be pretty damn good...a bit heavy on the RHH but still it'll score some runs.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:18 am 
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Rosenthal was reporting, either a Kopech centered deal or a Giolitto centered deal, but not both in one deal.


Not a fan of that. Although, I think out of the 2, Giolitto is the head case, and might not reach his full potential because of it.


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 7:59 am 
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Cashman wrote:
Rosenthal was reporting, either a Kopech centered deal or a Giolitto centered deal, but not both in one deal.


Not a fan of that. Although, I think out of the 2, Giolitto is the head case, and might not reach his full potential because of it.



I think it's the opposite, Kopech is the nutjob. Still, I'd rather not make the deal for Kopech. His upside is bigger. I guess if there were some kind of window to negotiate with Machado and you could sign him to a seven year deal, it would be something to consider. This guy is the real centerpiece to a lineup and Kopech is a minor leaguer who throws hard. I don't think it's a bad thing for your shortstop to be your best player.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:05 am 
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It is hard to resist making a deal giving up prospects for a player that might instantly become the best player in Chicago. That said, no extension, no deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:27 am 
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I'd hold onto as many prospects as i could, hope 45% pan out and be a young solid, cost controlled team in 2 years. It's not hard to pick up a big bat via FA. This would be a bad move by Hahn.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:27 am 
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pittmike wrote:
It is hard to resist making a deal giving up prospects for a player that might instantly become the best player in Chicago. That said, no extension, no deal.
Agreed. The deal has to be contingent on Machado singing an extension here. The O's have to allow for a 48-72 hour window to negotiate an extension. Get a deal in place, offer him the best $ deal you can, and see if he takes it. If he does then he plays SS and I couldn't care less what happens to Tim Anderson. If he doesn't, then no deal and you sharpen your pencil when Machado hits the FA market.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:04 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Cashman wrote:
Rosenthal was reporting, either a Kopech centered deal or a Giolitto centered deal, but not both in one deal.


Not a fan of that. Although, I think out of the 2, Giolitto is the head case, and might not reach his full potential because of it.



I think it's the opposite, Kopech is the nutjob. Still, I'd rather not make the deal for Kopech. His upside is bigger. I guess if there were some kind of window to negotiate with Machado and you could sign him to a seven year deal, it would be something to consider. This guy is the real centerpiece to a lineup and Kopech is a minor leaguer who throws hard. I don't think it's a bad thing for your shortstop to be your best player.



Head care not as in crazy, more like overthinking and putting it together. A confidence issue.


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:10 am 
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I like that they dont want to lose anymore and see 2018 as a transition year at worst, but this is too far. It just doesn't make sense for them to push all their chips in right now. A year from now I would probably be fine with it, but a year from now Machado will be a free agent the Sox can just sign him. And if the Sox think they aren't going to be in a position to sign Machado a year from now then holy shit do not trade either of your two best starters for 2018. Manny Machado is not going to club the White Sox to the playoffs if the #2 starter is James Shields.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:10 am 
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Cashman wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Cashman wrote:
Rosenthal was reporting, either a Kopech centered deal or a Giolitto centered deal, but not both in one deal.


Not a fan of that. Although, I think out of the 2, Giolitto is the head case, and might not reach his full potential because of it.



I think it's the opposite, Kopech is the nutjob. Still, I'd rather not make the deal for Kopech. His upside is bigger. I guess if there were some kind of window to negotiate with Machado and you could sign him to a seven year deal, it would be something to consider. This guy is the real centerpiece to a lineup and Kopech is a minor leaguer who throws hard. I don't think it's a bad thing for your shortstop to be your best player.



Head care not as in crazy, more like overthinking and putting it together. A confidence issue.

Well he lost a ton off his fastball and had to relearn pitching.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:17 am 
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Machado will definitely bring a bit of an edge to the clubhouse, which I do not see as a bad thing. A little fire and passhun can go a long way.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:18 am 
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I can’t imagine them trading Kopech or Giolito even for a guy like Machado. They are core guys. If they can’t make a trade from their depth then they shouldn’t do it.


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:18 am 
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Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:24 am 
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pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.



No thank you


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:28 am 
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pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.

Rodon is probably the best I'd do and I cannot imagine him being worth anything anymore.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 10:47 am 
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America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.
Agree 100%

What a dumb move by the O's. Wouldn't it behoove them to have just played status quo with Machado, and then flip him during the season?

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:05 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.
Agree 100%

What a dumb move by the O's. Wouldn't it behoove them to have just played status quo with Machado, and then flip him during the season?


That is probably going to end up happening.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:09 am 
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Seacrest wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.
Agree 100%

What a dumb move by the O's. Wouldn't it behoove them to have just played status quo with Machado, and then flip him during the season?


That is probably going to end up happening.



IF you give up a Giolitto, what are you flipping Machado for?


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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:33 am 
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Cashman wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.
Agree 100%

What a dumb move by the O's. Wouldn't it behoove them to have just played status quo with Machado, and then flip him during the season?


That is probably going to end up happening.



IF you give up a Giolitto, what are you flipping Machado for?



Gleyber Torres and Chance Adams.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:10 pm 
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Pal wrote:
Juiced wrote:
Pal wrote:
If he can be gotten for a combo like Cease, Fulmer, and maybe Tim Anderson and obviously an agreed extension, why wouldn't you want this. They are gonna go all in next year to get him, get it done a year early.


Maybe Tim Anderson :lol: Yeah, I am sure they are salivating at getting Cease and Fulmer. This is worse then Cub fans thinking they can still get Archer for Swarbs. "Oh, but he lost weight and put a batting cage in his house!" :roll:

What do you think they are going to land for a player with one year left, even if Sox were to get an extension?


I don't understand the Sox going after him for just one year. Doesn't make sense. I assumed they would require an extension if they where going to trade prospects for him. Why would the Orioles move Machado for low level prospects like Cease and Fulmer? They still need to sell tickets next year. Orioles would need to get a top prospect to justify losing a once in a generation ballplayer.

On the flipside, why would the sox trade a top prospect for a one year rental? Why would they even want a one year rental? How does that help your rebuild? It only hurts it, unless you are trying to compete this year and then you still only have Machado for one year and MAYBE a wildcard birth. Makes no sense.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:12 pm 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Cashman wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.
Agree 100%

What a dumb move by the O's. Wouldn't it behoove them to have just played status quo with Machado, and then flip him during the season?


That is probably going to end up happening.



IF you give up a Giolitto, what are you flipping Machado for?



Gleyber Torres and Chance Adams.


This also makes no sense to me. Why wouldn't the Orioles just trade Machado for Torres and Adams? You are basically saying Giolitto = Torres and that is insane.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:13 pm 
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That is insane, I agree.

Giolito > Torres

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:19 pm 
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Juiced wrote:
This also makes no sense to me. Why wouldn't the Orioles just trade Machado for Torres and Adams? You are basically saying Giolitto = Torres and that is insane.


The timing means everything. What if the Yankee offense is struggling in July and they're three behind Boston? If you mean why would the White Sox do such a deal, Well, yeah, Giolito is likely more valuable than Torres but it wouldn't be a one-for-one deal. The Sox would have to give more for Machado than just Giolito in the first place and they may be able to get a bunch more back from a desperate team. I agree that's a risky game to play because if you can't swing it and Machado walks, you look really fucking stupid. Unless you win next season with Machado.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:46 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
America wrote:
pittmike wrote:
Latest score update said the agent is saying no negotiation window for acquiring team.

Yea forget it.
Agree 100%

What a dumb move by the O's. Wouldn't it behoove them to have just played status quo with Machado, and then flip him during the season?


His agent is Scott Boras, right?

In that case, no deal under any circumstances. Boras will never let one of his players sign an extension here given how much he loves Reinsdorf.

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:50 pm 
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God I am tired of Boras. Can't a new crop of agents come up and make him less important?

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 Post subject: Re: Manny Machado
PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:51 pm 
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it is not boras


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