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HOF’er Harold Baines

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Seacrest

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:40 am

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Darkside wrote:

Panther pislA wrote:

Darkside wrote:

Nardi wrote:

Darkside wrote:

He was on with mully and haugh today.
Dude has all the personality of a tree stump.

At least a tree stump has a ring.

Zing.

Baines has a ring. . .

2005 yo.

Yeah. A bench coach. Yo.

So no zing then huh?? :lol:

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Darkside

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:08 am

Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:29 am
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Seacrest wrote:

Darkside wrote:

Panther pislA wrote:

Darkside wrote:

Nardi wrote:

Darkside wrote:

He was on with mully and haugh today.
Dude has all the personality of a tree stump.

At least a tree stump has a ring.

Zing.

Baines has a ring. . .

2005 yo.

Yeah. A bench coach. Yo.

So no zing then huh?? :lol:

zing still in effect.
Tha batboy has a ring too.

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bigfan wrote:

Many that is true, but an incomplete statement.

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Seacrest

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:36 am

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Seacrest wrote:

Darkside wrote:

Panther pislA wrote:

Darkside wrote:

Nardi wrote:

Darkside wrote:

He was on with mully and haugh today.
Dude has all the personality of a tree stump.

At least a tree stump has a ring.

Zing.

Baines has a ring. . .

2005 yo.

Yeah. A bench coach. Yo.

So no zing then huh?? :lol:

Darkside wrote:

zing still in effect.
Tha batboy has a ring too.

As well as the tree.

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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

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Darkside

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:53 am

Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:29 am
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Location: Darkside Estates
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Uh... ok. Top quality post there, Seacrest.

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bigfan wrote:

Many that is true, but an incomplete statement.

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MartyD47

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:53 pm

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Baines was the best clutch player the Sox have had in my lifetime. He was a great 7-9th inning hitter when considering who batted behind him.

Sox clutch players in my lifetime:

3. Joe Crede
2. "Big Game" Freddy Garcia
1. Harold Baines

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Frank Coztansa

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:14 pm

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Had a heart and kidney transplant last May.

https://www.mlb.com/news/harold-baines- ... transplant

Quote:

CHICAGO -- Harold Baines has been part of more than 30 home openers as a Hall of Fame player, coach and ambassador for the White Sox organization.

When he arrives with his wife, Marla, at Guaranteed Rate Field on Tuesday morning for the 2022 home opener in Chicago, something will feel different. Baines, now 63, will arrive almost 11 months removed from a life-saving heart and kidney transplant surgery at Johns Hopkins Hospital in Baltimore.

Surviving and recovering from the surgery has provided Baines, a Maryland native, a new lease on life. But as he told MLB.com Thursday evening, the goal for Baines on that night simply was getting to Friday.

“Just focus on Tuesday when Tuesday comes,” Baines said. “I’m excited to get back after two years and not being there. Today, I just take it one day at a time.”

...

Upon discovering the grave condition of Baines’ heart, a balloon pump was implanted to help the blood circulate. The balloon pump wasn’t helping enough, and Baines was placed on an Extracorporeal Membrane Oxygenation Machine (ECMO), which pumps and oxygenates a patient's blood outside the body, allowing the heart and lungs to rest.

“I don’t want to sensationalize it, but it’s really one step away from death in many ways,” said Dr Ahmet Kilic, director, heart transplantation and associate professor of surgery for Johns Hopkins University said. “The entire blood supply from your body is being shunted through these catheters and to this device that oxygenates and pumps blood, so it acts to both the right and left side of your heart, as well as your lungs.”

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:24 pm

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Damn. I was always a Baines fan. Not sure why you White Sox guys had such an issue with him.

I thought they should have 2 statues and retired his number a third time.

I really did think he was a great player.

How do you know when you have issues like that. The heart I get. But some of the other organs don't have nerves that you would feel pain. Glad to see he got the 2-for-1 surgery special. Sounds like the White Sox health care plan.

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Joe Orr Road Rod

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:30 pm

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I was pretty shocked when I read that. Jerry pushing so hard for him to get into the HoF makes more sense now.

I'm a Sox fan. I like Harold Baines. I think he was a great player. But he's not really what I would call a Hall of Famer. There are just too many guys similar to him. Some are in and some aren't. I would have kept them all out.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:36 pm

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

I agree. I'll blaspheme and say Andre Dawson is probably the demarcation line...and he probably shouldn't have gotten in.

One of my favorite players of all time. Probably shouldn't be in.

Jim Rice, another. Shouldn't Fred Lynn be in also, then? Let's let everyone in. Statues all around.

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Joe Orr Road Rod

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:41 pm

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

This is a good argument starter, but I put Jim Rice on a level above the Baineses, Parkers, Dawsons, Lynns, etc. I get that by the modern standard of what is valued, i.e. walks, his numbers are less than other guys. Some even make a case that his teammate Dewey Evans is a more deserving Hall of Famer. Having lived through that time and watched my team play those guys many times, I find that utterly absurd. Any pitcher who had to deal with that lineup was concerned first and foremost with Rice. Then Lynn. Nobody was game planning to get around Dwight Evans, nice player though he was.

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RFDC

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:43 pm

Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 4:11 pm
Posts: 55832

Damn that sucks , seems like a truly nice guy

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denisdman

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:47 pm

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Agree in full. We all love seeing our heroes get in, but the bar should be very high. Dawson was below it to me.

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Joe Orr Road Rod

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:49 pm

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RFDC wrote:

Damn that sucks , seems like a truly nice guy

It seems like he's doing well.

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Hawg Ass

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:55 pm

Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 2:00 pm
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Thoughts on a Dale Murphy?

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 2:15 pm

Hawg Ass wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Thoughts on a Dale Murphy?

Very good player. Rookie card was valuable at one time.

No chance in hell he should be in. If I'm arguing against Dawson (and Rice - though I think Rice is probably good, wouldn't argue too hard against him), Murphy is out.

I'm guessing he struck out again in the time it took me to type this post.

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Joe Orr Road Rod

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 2:18 pm

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Hawg Ass wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Thoughts on a Dale Murphy?

I would put him in that group with Dawson, Baines, Parker, Lynn. He did win back-to-back MVPs though.

I remember at one time there were only nine guys who had won consecutive MVP awards, one for each position. Murphy was the guy who completed the lineup.

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man of few opinions

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 2:22 pm

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Hawg Ass wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Thoughts on a Dale Murphy?

dale murphy had a great run, back-to-back MVP's, he deserves to be in more than a bunch of others that already are. he's a forgotten man now though, most youngsters dont even know his name.

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man of few opinions

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 2:27 pm

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i just peeked at Murphy's stats, and saw in '87 he hit 44 homers with a .295 avg and a .997 OPS and only finished 11th in MVP voting.

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Hawg Ass

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 2:28 pm

Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 2:00 pm
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Hawg Ass wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Thoughts on a Dale Murphy?

That's the part that I have a hard time with and I would lean that he should be in.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:07 pm

Murphy had 4 amazing years and 14 or so other years of being very good.

He's on the fence for me. But, given who they are letting in now, he should be in.

Just looked, can't believe he had a 30/30 year. SB were a thing back in the '80s. Put him in.

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Joe Orr Road Rod

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:15 pm

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

I think you have to consider how friendly Fulton Co. Stadium was for hitters too.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:19 pm

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

I think you have to consider how friendly Fulton Co. Stadium was for hitters too.

More friendly than Fenway?

People were openly displaying acts of racism there.

Wait...which stadium was I talking about?

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Frank Coztansa

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:23 pm

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As I mentioned years ago in this thread, you also have to consider how unfriendly for home runs that Old Comiskey was when talking about Harold.

For the debate above, I agree with all except for Dawson. He had the defense (early on) to go with his offense that most of the other guys didn't have. Parker had a Howitzer arm, was basically Eloy out there in the OF.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:30 pm

There's no question Dawson was injured by playing for Montreal on that Olympic stadium they called a baseball field.

Maybe if they had signed LoHo, things would have been different.

The fact that he had an amazing career after that is a credit to him. But, he didn't quite get there.

But, I grew up in the era of like 11 guys ever had 500 HRs. That was kind of the benchmark and worked down from there and then suddenly, for no apparent reason that anyone can explain, offensive statistics got kind of crazy.

I blame the Pirates rampant cocaine problem.

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vitoscotti

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:35 pm

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2 different positions, but offensive stats very similar.

Ron Santo
277 .362 .464 .826..125

Harold Baines
289 356 465 .820 121

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BigW72

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2022 8:27 am

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vitoscotti wrote:

2 different positions, but offensive stats very similar.

Ron Santo
277 .362 .464 .826..125

Harold Baines
289 356 465 .820 121

Position does matter.
I don't think Santo belongs in Cooperstown, but his numbers present a much stronger argument than Baines. It's fine they are both in, as the list of undeserving players started before them.

At this point, the #1 argument on the HoF is the fact the Bonds isn't in it.

Hope Harold recovers and stays with us for many more years to come.

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Nardi

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2022 9:14 pm

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BigW72 wrote:

At this point, the #1 argument on the HoF is the fact the Bonds isn't in it.

Especially now that Ortiz is in. So I guess it's a likability factor. NEW criteria. Hello, Curt Schilling.

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BigW72

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:50 am

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Some very good examples in this article.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/109 ... place-them

Kirby Puckett is a fun debate.

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Nardi

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 6:24 am

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Quote:

The critical tiebreaker is that Evans knew how to draw walks, which made him more valuable at the plate. He was a three-time American League walks champion.

Something for youngsters to dream about. The walks crown.

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Joe Orr Road Rod

Post subject: Re: HOF’er Harold Baines

Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 6:38 am

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Nardi wrote:

Quote:

The critical tiebreaker is that Evans knew how to draw walks, which made him more valuable at the plate. He was a three-time American League walks champion.

Something for youngsters to dream about. The walks crown.

The fetishization of the walk is what has made the game so damn boring.

Regarding Puckett, he's a short career guy but his numbers are there. There are only about 60 guys with a higher career batting average in baseball history. I guess I would ask this question- if you took Jackie Robinson's numbers and divorced them from who he was and what he meant, let's say they were for another guy who played in the 80s, would that guy be a Hall of Famer? I think he probably would. And that guy would be similar to Puckett. Short brilliant career.

Evans was a nice player. A guy you would want on your team. But nobody ever watched him and thought they were watching greatness. It's not as if the whole world was watching baseball and everyone just missed how awesome this one guy was. I'm not going to listen to some 25 year old dope who subscribes to Fangraphs haughtily explain to me how Evans was better than Rice and Lynn but all of us oldheads were just too damn dumb to know it.

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