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veganfan21
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:32 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
There comes a point where ANY of the primary people in the Bulls dynasty can simply say "Count the number of rings" in reference to their career. Jerry, Jerry, Phil, Michael, Scottie.

If the goal is to win titles, and you win 6 of them then you are pretty good at whatever job you had to do it as compared to others who have similar jobs.


I'll just say it here: if you think Krause wasn't integral to the Bulls run in the '90s then you're either trolling or huge dumbass.

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long time guy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:34 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
There comes a point where ANY of the primary people in the Bulls dynasty can simply say "Count the number of rings" in reference to their career. Jerry, Jerry, Phil, Michael, Scottie.

If the goal is to win titles, and you win 6 of them then you are pretty good at whatever job you had to do it as compared to others who have similar jobs.


I'll just say it here: if you think Krause wasn't integral to the Bulls run in the '90s then you're either trolling or huge dumbass.


No I'm a guy that knows what actually happened as opposed to merely one that heard about it from other sources.

Guys that believe he was "integral" are the actual dumbasses

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vitoscotti
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billypootons wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
Krause was a fill-in in charge of the Bulls draft in '76, then GM from '85- early '03.
My thoughts on his #1 draft picks:

'76- Scott May...a bust
'85- Charles Oakley (via trade)...hard nosed aggressive player, but not all-star caliber.
"86- Brad Sellers...huge bust
'87- 2 1st rd.picks Scottie Pippin (via trade).. spectacular player. Jeff Sanders...a bust
'88- Wil Purdue (via trade)...a bust. Bulls trade Oakley and swapped 1st rd. picks with the Knicks. Knicks selected solid NBA playe Rod Strickland (career 18 PER). Bulls also got Bill Cartwright a so-so guy in the regular season, but rose to the occasion in post season.
'89- Stacey King...a bust
'90- traded 1st rd. for trash. Got very good player Toni Kukoc 2nd. Rd.
'91- Mark Randall...a bust
'92- Byron Houston...a bust traded later in the year for bums
'93- Corie Blount ...a bust
'94- Dickey Simpkins...a bust
'95- Jason Caffey- a bust
'96- Travis Knight...a bust
'97- Keith booth...a bust
'98- Corey Benjamin ...a bust
'99- 2 1st. rd. picks Eton Brand, Metta World Peace...solid draft
'00- 3 #1 picks. Marcus's Pfizer, Chris Mihm, Dalibor Bagaric...all bums. Mihn was traded for Jamal Crawford. A solid pro, but after he left the Bulls
'01- Eddie Curry... Soft. Disappointing pick. Traded great player Elton Brand for another disappointing player Tyson Chandler.
'02- Jay Williams...showed signs of brilliance after slow start. Tragic accident ended his career.


les' most recent show was to read off all jerry krause draft picks?


Added Grant and Armstrong I missed. Must admit witty jab.
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Terry's Peeps
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 4:09 pm 
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long time guy wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
There comes a point where ANY of the primary people in the Bulls dynasty can simply say "Count the number of rings" in reference to their career. Jerry, Jerry, Phil, Michael, Scottie.

If the goal is to win titles, and you win 6 of them then you are pretty good at whatever job you had to do it as compared to others who have similar jobs.


I'll just say it here: if you think Krause wasn't integral to the Bulls run in the '90s then you're either trolling or huge dumbass.


No I'm a guy that knows what actually happened as opposed to merely one that heard about it from other sources.

Guys that believe he was "integral" are the actual dumbasses


This ended up being the problem with perception of the Bulls. It was always a 100% credit/blame for the teams.

Krause was definitely integral to the construction of 6 championship teams.

Players and Phil were quite naturally integral as well.

There was always enough credit to go around. Neither side could share it though.

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long time guy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 4:17 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
long time guy wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
There comes a point where ANY of the primary people in the Bulls dynasty can simply say "Count the number of rings" in reference to their career. Jerry, Jerry, Phil, Michael, Scottie.

If the goal is to win titles, and you win 6 of them then you are pretty good at whatever job you had to do it as compared to others who have similar jobs.


I'll just say it here: if you think Krause wasn't integral to the Bulls run in the '90s then you're either trolling or huge dumbass.


No I'm a guy that knows what actually happened as opposed to merely one that heard about it from other sources.

Guys that believe he was "integral" are the actual dumbasses


This ended up being the problem with perception of the Bulls. It was always a 100% credit/blame for the teams.

Krause was definitely integral to the construction of 6 championship teams.

Players and Phil were quite naturally integral as well.

There was always enough credit to go around. Neither side could share it though.


There were 4 people there for all 6. Krause was by far the least integral of the 4. His insecurities was the thing that was most at work in that situation. . Thats why "Organizations win Championships" statement was made. That is why he said that nothing would please him more than winning one without Jordan.

I never have blamed him for the breakup of the team. That was always unfair to him.

Whenever I looked at the supporting cast during those years it was more often than not found to be lacking.

His legacy will be as a GM that won 6. Can't take that away from him

Architect and all that nah. He didn't have to do all that much orchestrating when you had Jordan. He made it easy for him

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BigW72
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My 19 yr old starting watching this and was commenting on Jerry Krause. He is oblivious to that era (obviously) so I explained to him...."at the time, he was as hated as any sports owner or executive". I waited a minute and then it hit me.
"and maybe this will make sense to you now....if you recall, anytime I've spilled food on my shirt (or someone else) I said "I kraused myself?" that's the reference.

He lost his shit laughing since I've made that reference since he was born :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:56 am 
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:lol: :lol:

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vitoscotti
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Motta came to condemn Krause, often dismissively saying Krause was the guy who talked him out of taking Tiny Archibald.

Sam Smith 2017
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Joe Orr Road Rod
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Would Jerry Krause have been considered a greater GM if he looked like Mitch Kupchak?

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Joe Orr Road Rod
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long time guy wrote:
There were 4 people there for all 6. Krause was by far the least integral of the 4.


:lol: This kind of misses the point that without Krause 75% of the four wouldn't have been there at all.

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long time guy
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:18 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
long time guy wrote:
There were 4 people there for all 6. Krause was by far the least integral of the 4.


:lol: This kind of misses the point that without Krause 75% of the four wouldn't have been there at all.


The guy comprising 25% of it was the only one that wasn't expendable.

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veganfan21
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:22 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
long time guy wrote:
There were 4 people there for all 6. Krause was by far the least integral of the 4.


:lol: This kind of misses the point that without Krause 75% of the four wouldn't have been there at all.


veganfan21 wrote:

I'll just say it here: if you think Krause wasn't integral to the Bulls run in the '90s then you're either trolling or huge dumbass.

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vitoscotti
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The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.
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veganfan21
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vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Would Jerry Krause have been considered a greater GM if he looked like Mitch Kupchak?

Yeah, probably, that and if he could shut the hell up once in a while. A short fat guy who was rude to everyone was never going to win a p.r. war against Michael Jordan, at one point possibly the most beloved man in the whole world. Variation on a theme from earlier in the week, but who was the general manager of all those Spurs teams? R.J. Buford? maybe? I don't quite remember. What is he like? Is he a slovenly Jewish guy who pisses everyone off? I have absolutely no idea. They probably like it that way!

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vitoscotti
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:37 am 
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veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.
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veganfan21
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vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.

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The Hawk
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veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.


To me, the best moves that Krause made were drafting Scottie Pippin and obtaining Dennis Rodman. Rodman especially was a brilliant move and he never gets enough credit for the dynasty that the Bulls had. He was an amazing defensive player and rebounder. The only big guy who he couldn't guard was Karl Malone.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:13 am 
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The Hawk wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.


To me, the best moves that Krause made were drafting Scottie Pippin and obtaining Dennis Rodman. Rodman especially was a brilliant move and he never gets enough credit for the dynasty that the Bulls had. He was an amazing defensive player and rebounder. The only big guy who he couldn't guard was Karl Malone.


He got inside Malone's head enough to be effective and a distraction.

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The Hawk
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
The Hawk wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.


To me, the best moves that Krause made were drafting Scottie Pippin and obtaining Dennis Rodman. Rodman especially was a brilliant move and he never gets enough credit for the dynasty that the Bulls had. He was an amazing defensive player and rebounder. The only big guy who he couldn't guard was Karl Malone.


He got inside Malone's head enough to be effective and a distraction.


He tried to get into everyone's head but I don't think that it worked with Malone. Its not a dig at Rodman but Malone was an absolute beast and no one could really defend him.

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Pippen got into Malone's head more than anyone ever.

The Mailman doesn't deliver on Sunday.

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Terry's Peeps wrote:
The Hawk wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.


To me, the best moves that Krause made were drafting Scottie Pippin and obtaining Dennis Rodman. Rodman especially was a brilliant move and he never gets enough credit for the dynasty that the Bulls had. He was an amazing defensive player and rebounder. The only big guy who he couldn't guard was Karl Malone.


He got inside Malone's head enough to be effective and a distraction.


"The Mailman doesn't deliver on Sundays!" - Scottie Pippen

One of the most effective lines ever uttered.

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long time guy
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vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Yep. A lot of coattail riding throughout that particular decade.

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long time guy
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veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.


He only the only person to score in the entire quarter prior to that shot by Paxson. Some supporting cast. Interesting that he retired shortly thereafter. Tired of carrying that collection of bums.

Grant was gone in 94 but keep going you're doing great thus far.

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Last edited by long time guy on Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Frank and Seacrest agreed on something.

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veganfan21
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long time guy wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
vitoscotti wrote:
The special should of been called "Michael Jordan". Reinsdorf, Krause, Phil, other players owe all their success in that period to MJ. Psycho Krause would be a labeled a huge nothing failure without MJ.


Michael would have been another Ewing or Barkley without Krause at worst (great player, no rings), and maybe a Hakeem at best (one or two rings). Had Michael been in charge of personnel he would have traded the picks used to draft Pippen and Grant for Rod Higgins and then signed Charles Oakley to a 25 year extension.

The greatest player of all-time on the roster erased a lot of Krause's many blunders.


Yeah, that was apparent when Michael passed it to himself to hit the three that won the Phoenix game in 1993. Or when he replaced Grant as the team's leading rebounder and grit guy in 1996.


He only the only person to score in the entire quarter prior to that shot by Paxson. Some supporting cast. Interesting that he retired shortly thereafter. Tired of carrying that collection of bums.

Grant was gone in 94 but keep going you're doing great thus far.


Grant was replaced by Rodman for the 95-96 season. Again, you don't seem to know your history despite being ancient.

Sorry to say it, but on Krause you're a certified dumbass.

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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Frank and Seacrest agreed on something.

Image


Frank's just mad I called him out.

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long time guy
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veganfan21 wrote:
long time guy wrote:
.

Grant was gone in 94 but keep going you're doing great thus far.


Grant was replaced by Rodman for the 95-96 season. Again, you don't seem to know your history despite being ancient.


Might want to cut your losses.
Quote:
Jul 1, 1994 - Horace Grant, previously with the Chicago Bulls, became a free agent. :|

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct- ... story.html

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veganfan21
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I never said anything about when Grant left. I said Rodman was brought in to replace him. I believe the way you'd put it is that Jordan himself traded Purdue for Rodman then took over his body during games to will the Bulls to victory. He also took over the bodies of Kukoc, Brown, Williams, Kerr, Harper, and Pippen. In his free time, he saved babies from raging fires by dropping them from high-rise buildings into the waiting arms of himself. Reportedly, he also gave birth to himself.

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veganfan21 wrote:
I never said anything about when Grant left. I said Rodman was brought in to replace him. I believe the way you'd put it is that Jordan himself traded Purdue for Rodman then took over his body during games to will the Bulls to victory. He also took over the bodies of Kukoc, Brown, Williams, Kerr, Harper, and Pippen. In his free time, he saved babies from raging fires by dropping them from high-rise buildings into the waiting arms of himself. Reportedly, he also gave birth to himself.

"Well, in a sense, to some extent, so to speak, I sprung forth, fully formed, from the head of Zeus. Tell Charles I said that! TELL HIM I SAID THAT!"

_________________
Molly Lambert wrote:
The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.
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