ZephMarshack wrote:
long time guy wrote:
You are basically suggesting by the use of the term "weighted", that there isn't any difference between the Bulls best player Butler and there 7th best player Gibson/Dunleavy?
No, I'm saying there's no difference between them for the purpose of the stat you're relying on to make the absurd case that Thibodeau never had the injury problems Hoiberg did this year. Thus the suggestion that it's too coarse of a measure.
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Secondly it's obvious that Dunleavy was a better player last season.
Which again a)does not mean that he was a quality starting 3 last season and b) undermines citing the 50+ games he's missed as an adequate excuse for the Bulls' poor performance.
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As was Pau Gasol too for that matter. Gasol at 34 had one of his best seasons. He was a hall of famer that played like a Hall of Famer
Can any of these declines in player form be attributed to The Mayor and his brilliant system or in every case are they unfortunate circumstances of a universe against poor Fred? Just wondering.
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The Noah "benched" stuff isn't registering either. The Bulls were 8 games up prior to his injury.
Why is "benched" in quotes here? Noah was benched. Did you miss the whole story about Hoiberg taking him out of the starting lineup and lying about Noah requesting it? And so should he be re-signed next year or what? In the other thread you were just dismissing him as more of a spiritual leader than a player, now his absence is what caused the season to go downhill?
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If there theoretically isn't much difference between Dunleavy and guys that replaced him, then why is Dunleavy continuing to start? Shouldn't a 35 yr old that is obviously on his last legs be benched because after all there isn't much difference? Obviously he is considered the better player.
Oh okay, he must be the best because Hoiberg thinks he's the best. I guess you don't think starting lineups are a fair point of criticism fans can make against a coach? Again, Dunleavy's played poorly since he's gotten back. His absence for 50 of his missed games is not a good excuse for the coach's performance.
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Citing the totality of Bulls injuries during selected Thibs yrs (2013) is a misnomer too and a good use of rhetorical sleight of hand. If I were to sight games missed due to injury for the entire roster what would my number be?
I used the stats I had on hand from
http://www.blogabull.com/2016/4/7/11321 ... rrick-rose This entire discussion started with your own sleight of hand as you yourself used multiple different stats from season to season to paint a picture of the Bulls being healthy under Thibodeau. They weren't.
The Bulls were .500 without Dunleavy in the lineup last season. Don't know how to quantify his absence but he was viewed as a key component while he was absent. He stinks this season and he also stunk during the series with Cleveland. I wasn't in favor of resigning him but they must think he is the best option at the position. I have personally stated that McDermott has to start over Dunleavy for the drafting of him to be validated. It also would be an upgrade. That Snell and McDermott couldn't beat out an over the hill bum that was never good in the first place is an indictment on the front office.
In terms of Noah, it seems that all you ever hear about or his leadership qualities. Noah is more than that in my opinion and I have always believed that intangibles are overrated. I much prefer the tangible aspect of sports. vague terms like "chemistry", "leadership", "energy", "effort", tend to overrate guys value i.e Taj Gibson. When you say that a guy was benched I tend to think of it in terms of not playing at all. Like what is occurring with Snell. Coming off the bench and benched are separate in my opinion and that is why I quoted it. Semantical argument. Not really important. Noah has to be a player to justify resigning him. If he is going to be simply a cheerleader let him roll. Lost in the discussions regarding his intangible qualities are the fact that he is still solid defensively, 7 foot tall, rebounds exceptionally well and is one of the best passing centers in the game. I don't want him to be resigned so that he can teach Mirotic how to play hard, or show Portis how to be a professional. Keep that.
I would assume that the vast majority of people on here believe Dunleavy to be the best option also. There was a thread titled "Dougie McSuckets" in which most bashed the guy relentlessly. No one is a fan of Snell either. Its not just Hoiberg that believes Dunleavy is the better option.
How can you suggest that the Bulls weren't healthy when his first season in the league there were numerous guys playing in 80 or more games.
Second season he had numerous guys playing in 60 or more games. Only McDermott has played in 80 or more games this season. How are these too things equal? Thibs really seems to get a pass for losing to Philly during that second season too. On the one hand I keep hearing how he can coach the team to heights unforeseen then in the next breath you hear about how he shouldn't be expected to be an 8th seed because he lost his best player. Which one is it?
Im not saying that the lost of Dunleavy and Noah alone are the reasons that Bulls lost. There were injuries to just about everyone of consequence on the team. Rose also played the first 5 or 6 weeks with a mask which obviously hindered his play.
Hoiberg made mistakes but I think the bigger issue is GarPax. They are not as good as I originally believed.
_________________
The Hawk wrote:
This is going to reach a head pretty soon.
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