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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 10:51 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 11:58 pm 
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Saros sounds like Antti Raanta II: Finnish Boogaloo, a sub-6' goalie in a league moving far away from that, who can turn out effective backup appearances but get exposed under a starting workload. Raanta is the starter in Phoenix now, so we'll see how that goes. Saros seems to be good without being tall, Lindback is tall without being good.

I'd have to see a depth chart for Nashville's forwards because I'm still not sold on what they have up front. They looked terrible without Johansen and perennial good-but-should-be-even-better guy Colin Wilson's gone to Denver.

Here's hoping you can stay healthy.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 12:48 pm 
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And just like that Kruger to Carolina...Is that the Hawks future consideration the draft pick that just got exchanged?

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:03 pm 
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https://twitter.com/ChartingHockey/stat ... 2337294336

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Our roster got obliterated. No team in the league comes REMOTELY close to losing the talent we lost. Shame on the Hawks for blowing their last good chance last year.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:12 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
https://twitter.com/ChartingHockey/status/884052982337294336

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Our roster got obliterated. No team in the league comes REMOTELY close to losing the talent we lost. Shame on the Hawks for blowing their last good chance last year.


Crapitols ARE closer than remotely close.

I assume they are counting the loss of Hossa, who had a stellar first half last season, but pretty much slid back into the muck the second half.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:14 pm 
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Pens are paying a bit of a price, too, but that was expected.

And further to that graphic, no team that has any chance (except for maybe Toronto?) at all got significantly better, either.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:35 pm 
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I can't believe how poorly people are grasping the loss of Hjalmarsson. He's the second-best stay-at-home defenseman in the league behind only Marc-Edouard Vlasic, and if you want to make the argument that Hjalmarsson is the best because he and the Hawks won two Stanley Cups leading the league in fewest goals allowed while Vlasic has won diddly-shit in the NHL, I will not stand in your way. Do you really think Connor Murphy, a player whose entire NHL career has been nothing but glorified scrimmages, can be anywhere as good as Hjalmarsson at virtually the same price? I don't care about term. If anything, that's a bug, not a feature: why do I need six years of an unproven commodity who probably isn't that good?

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:10 pm 
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Oh, no fucking doubt that the loss of Hammer's gonna hurt - I was as sorry to see him go as I was Saad 2 years ago.

They're not gonna make Hammer's loss up, but it is what it is, and as I have said he may have already peaked, and I predict that his career arc was gonna seriously go downhill with the Hawks due to the absolute pounding his lower legs have taken. As the cliche goes, better to trade a good player a year too early...

I hope for his sake that his role on a crappy team doesn't include being the human slapshot wall.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:18 pm 
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Minooka Meatball wrote:
Pens are paying a bit of a price, too, but that was expected.

And further to that graphic, no team that has any chance (except for maybe Toronto?) at all got significantly better, either.


What's really sad/funny is the third-biggest GAR net loss:

The Florida Panther.

That's how much of a disasterfuck of a franchise is when they couldn't even bumblefuck their way into a theoretic offensive improvement :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:25 pm 
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FLA is so screwed they fired everyone and put Talon back in charge. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 10:01 pm 
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Minooka Meatball wrote:
Minooka Meatball wrote:
Pens are paying a bit of a price, too, but that was expected.

And further to that graphic, no team that has any chance (except for maybe Toronto?) at all got significantly better, either.


What's really sad/funny is the third-biggest GAR net loss:

The Florida Panther.

That's how much of a disasterfuck of a franchise is when they couldn't even bumblefuck their way into a theoretic offensive improvement :lol:


The Panthers were accidentally good in 2016 and then they messed with everything that made them accidentally good so they could be a Smart Analytics Team, at which point they fucked up everything. Also, Barkov was hurt, and it seems like Barkov is always going to be hurt. The Panthers will always be the Panthers.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 11:34 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
I can't believe how poorly people are grasping the loss of Hjalmarsson. He's the second-best stay-at-home defenseman in the league behind only Marc-Edouard Vlasic, and if you want to make the argument that Hjalmarsson is the best because he and the Hawks won two Stanley Cups leading the league in fewest goals allowed while Vlasic has won diddly-shit in the NHL, I will not stand in your way. Do you really think Connor Murphy, a player whose entire NHL career has been nothing but glorified scrimmages, can be anywhere as good as Hjalmarsson at virtually the same price? I don't care about term. If anything, that's a bug, not a feature: why do I need six years of an unproven commodity who probably isn't that good?


You fail to grasp how a salary cap works and the limitations it imposes on NHL teams.

Especially the real good ones. At least let Murphy play for half a season before bitching up that storm. It took three years for you to be right about Toews, but you finally made it. Try and find a little happiness in that for yourself.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 11:42 pm 
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They're not making meaningful savings trading 4.1 for 3.8 but never let anything stop you from condescending to me as if I don't know how the goddamn salary cap works.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:17 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
They're not making meaningful savings trading 4.1 for 3.8 but never let anything stop you from condescending to me as if I don't know how the goddamn salary cap works.



Apparently you don't. Or you chose to willfully ignore it in order to find something new to complain about.

The savings is in the salary, as well as the added length and fixed cost years of Murphy's contract. The Hawks traded for him knowing they wouldn't likely be able to sign Hammer when his deal is up. Unless he wants to play at a discount. And then they would get him back either way, plus Murphy.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:52 pm 
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The fixed cost doesn't mean that much, especially if he's yet another Country Club Superstar who wilts when the games count. And I'm not even sure he's that -- the Coyotes faithful were over the moon to get Hjalmarsson for Murphy. So if he's a guy who's just okay at 93% of the hit of a guy who is elite, where's the heist? And the long term of the contract doesn't feel so great considering the likelihood that the cap goes down in the next few years: TV contracts on both sides of the border are locked up, they're pretty much maxing out their revenue streams unless you think they're going to start selling out in Raleigh and shit soon, and the Canadian dollar is always in peril of dropping to 65 cents American again.

I don't know. I wouldn't worry about years down the road. You have two more years, maybe three before it all goes to hell. I would just try to get the most out of the last years of the Toews/Kane/Keith core and sort through the wreckage later.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:17 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
The fixed cost doesn't mean that much, especially if he's yet another Country Club Superstar who wilts when the games count. And I'm not even sure he's that -- the Coyotes faithful were over the moon to get Hjalmarsson for Murphy. So if he's a guy who's just okay at 93% of the hit of a guy who is elite, where's the heist? And the long term of the contract doesn't feel so great considering the likelihood that the cap goes down in the next few years: TV contracts on both sides of the border are locked up, they're pretty much maxing out their revenue streams unless you think they're going to start selling out in Raleigh and shit soon, and the Canadian dollar is always in peril of dropping to 65 cents American again.

I don't know. I wouldn't worry about years down the road. You have two more years, maybe three before it all goes to hell. I would just try to get the most out of the last years of the Toews/Kane/Keith core and sort through the wreckage later.



I think the fixed cost means a shit load unless Seabrooke comes down with a skin condition and Saad doesn't revive Toews like everyone is hoping.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:12 am 
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I think most grasp the loss of Hammer just fine. it sucks. It hurts. Connor Murphy is not Hammer. Get it.

The options were very limited here. Cap money had to get moved and Hammer was only one of a few that had value. Murphy is certainly unproven and a gamble, but keeping Hammer wouldn't have saved this team. Something had to give....MM had it correct....best to trade early than too late.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 9:23 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
I can't believe how poorly people are grasping the loss of Hjalmarsson. He's the second-best stay-at-home defenseman in the league behind only Marc-Edouard Vlasic, and if you want to make the argument that Hjalmarsson is the best because he and the Hawks won two Stanley Cups leading the league in fewest goals allowed while Vlasic has won diddly-shit in the NHL, I will not stand in your way. Do you really think Connor Murphy, a player whose entire NHL career has been nothing but glorified scrimmages, can be anywhere as good as Hjalmarsson at virtually the same price? I don't care about term. If anything, that's a bug, not a feature: why do I need six years of an unproven commodity who probably isn't that good?


Hammer had a decline in his 2nd half play last year and had a lackluster playoffs. He's played a lot of hard hockey over the years and it's likely that his best hockey is behind him and that he is on the decline. Murphy on the other hand had good possession numbers relative to his teammates on a poor Arizona team and he should be only getting better. Bowman loved him when working with Team USA which helped precipitate this trade. I am definitely optimistic that it works out.

Hammer was one of my favorite Hawks over this run but I would rather trade him a year too soon than too late.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 9:27 pm 
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DAC is a GAAP accounting term for insurance companies, deferred acquisition costs. It exists because of the matching principal whereby revenues and expenses are recorded together. Under statutory insurance accounting, DAC does not exist and expenses such as agent commissions are charged against earnings immediately.

For this and other valuable lessons, create a user name that is an acronym for an accounting term.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 9:32 pm 
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DAC wrote:
Bowman loved him when working with Team USA which helped precipitate this trade.

Ah yes, Team USA, that great proving ground of brains and brawn where we let Brian Burke build a roster around Justin Abdelkader and Brandon Dubinsky because they're mean.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 6:43 am 
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Curious Hair wrote:
Ah yes, Team USA, that great proving ground of brains and brawn where we let Brian Burke build a roster around Justin Abdelkader and Brandon Dubinsky because they're mean.


Does this have anything to do with Bowman and Murphy?

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 11:32 am 
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DAC wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
I can't believe how poorly people are grasping the loss of Hjalmarsson. He's the second-best stay-at-home defenseman in the league behind only Marc-Edouard Vlasic, and if you want to make the argument that Hjalmarsson is the best because he and the Hawks won two Stanley Cups leading the league in fewest goals allowed while Vlasic has won diddly-shit in the NHL, I will not stand in your way. Do you really think Connor Murphy, a player whose entire NHL career has been nothing but glorified scrimmages, can be anywhere as good as Hjalmarsson at virtually the same price? I don't care about term. If anything, that's a bug, not a feature: why do I need six years of an unproven commodity who probably isn't that good?


Hammer had a decline in his 2nd half play last year and had a lackluster playoffs. He's played a lot of hard hockey over the years and it's likely that his best hockey is behind him and that he is on the decline. Murphy on the other hand had good possession numbers relative to his teammates on a poor Arizona team and he should be only getting better. Bowman loved him when working with Team USA which helped precipitate this trade. I am definitely optimistic that it works out.

Hammer was one of my favorite Hawks over this run but I would rather trade him a year too soon than too late.


I think many of us watched him against Nashville and realized that he didn't appear to be the player he once was. We also watched the entire Hawks blue line group get outskated, outhit and out played in that series.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:11 pm 
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The whole team looked like garbage. I wouldn't single out Hjalmarsson as the one where I'd say "that's it, it's official, he can never meaningfully contribute to the Blackhawks ever again." I did say that about Panarin and, well, at least I got that one right, I guess.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:46 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
The whole team looked like garbage. I wouldn't single out Hjalmarsson as the one where I'd say "that's it, it's official, he can never meaningfully contribute to the Blackhawks ever again." I did say that about Panarin and, well, at least I got that one right, I guess.


I agree that Hammer wasn't the only problem against Nashville. Unfortunately, the Hawks cannot move the Seabrook contract and he'll be here until the next round of compliance buyouts occur after the next work stoppage. What's that- 2 more years?

But I am optimistic about the trade when you consider Hammer's poor 2nd half, poor playoffs, the fact that his best hockey is behind him, the odds that his game will not age as well as better skating dman, and the fact that you acquired a younger player that should get better. It might backfire but I am hopeful that Bowman scouted Murphy well and found a good fit for the team. I remember people criticizing Bowman for getting Oduya (the first time) and that worked out very well.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:59 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
The whole team looked like garbage. I wouldn't single out Hjalmarsson as the one where I'd say "that's it, it's official, he can never meaningfully contribute to the Blackhawks ever again." I did say that about Panarin and, well, at least I got that one right, I guess.



I didn't single him out. I said everyone across the blue line looked bad. Nor did I or anyone else say that he could no longer contribute.

For the reasons DAC and I have stated, it has the possibility of being a good trade for a number of reasons.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:31 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
The whole team looked like garbage. I wouldn't single out Hjalmarsson as the one where I'd say "that's it, it's official, he can never meaningfully contribute to the Blackhawks ever again." I did say that about Panarin and, well, at least I got that one right, I guess.



I didn't single him out. I said everyone across the blue line looked bad. Nor did I or anyone else say that he could no longer contribute.

For the reasons DAC and I have stated, it has the possibility of being a good trade for a number of reasons.


Yes....and had the Hawks stood as is, they'd at or just over the salary cap and they'd be another first round exit. SOMETHING had to go and Hammer was one of very few players with a movable contract. it sucks, but the options were limited.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 8:31 am 
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wdelaney72 wrote:
but the options were limited.


Because they just had to give Seabrook that NTC. They gave him a max year, free agent market rate contract a year before they had to THEN they throw in the NTC clause. I have generally been a Bowman fan but he really botched that contract and along with Toews's decline, it will be the difference between this team having another run or two deep in the playoffs versus them being a continual 1st or 2nd round exit. They are a Kane/Keith/Crawford injury away from missing the playoffs.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 8:41 am 
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DAC wrote:
They are a Kane/Keith/Crawford injury away from missing the playoffs.



Or are they? If they get hurt, how much cap $$ would they get for a trade?


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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:03 am 
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Cashman wrote:
DAC wrote:
They are a Kane/Keith/Crawford injury away from missing the playoffs.



Or are they? If they get hurt, how much cap $$ would they get for a trade?


True. They would get some relief but you are not going to replace their talent.

At least the Hawks are not hosting the draft any time soon so Bowman will be allowed to trade their #1 pick if needed.

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 Post subject: Re: 2017 Offseason
PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:06 am 
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Put me in the Hammer has a lot of miles on his body and don't think it's that big a deal losing him.

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