I just hope the legalize polygamy...

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"Now comes good sailing. Moose. Indian."

I'm not a Conservative, least of all a religious Conservative. But the last line is pretty obviously true. If not for Donald Trump we'd be 3/4 of the way into a minimum of 16 years of consecutive neoliberal leadership in the Oval Office.

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

I get that is true but once Hillary was gone as a viable candidate he should have lost the support of those Christians. Maybe as a side effect we could get the weirdo Christian fringe in Mike Pence!

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'm not the one who argued that an evil can never achieve a good. Interestingly enough, I've sat at lunch and listened to you play the David French role to Seacrest's Sohrab Ahmari.

Unlike the two of you- and French and Ahmari- I'm an atheist. My viewpoint on these issues focuses on the economic first and foremost. But I think a case can be made that certain social structures and moral values form the basis for the economic dignity in question. And I would argue that most people who post here including those from opposite sides of the political spectrum basically agree with this part of Ahmari's "manifesto":

"They are our fellow citizens, not interchangeable economic units. And as Americans we owe each other a distinct allegiance and must put each other first.

The Republican Party has for too long held investors and “job creators” above workers and citizens, dismissing vast swaths of Americans as takers unworthy of its time. Trump’s victory, driven in part by his appeal to working-class voters, shows the potential of a political movement that heeds the cries of the working class as much as the demands of capital. Americans take more pride in their identity as workers than their identity as consumers. Economic and welfare policy should prioritize work over consumption."

https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusi ... -consensus

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

Consumption keeps the "kick the can down the road" economy and government revenues flowing.

You drop the bombs on Japan to save lives and end the suffering. That goes for both sides.

You bomb Dresden and carpet bomb/fire bomb everything else because that results in less Wehrmacht soldiers going east. Thus hastening the end of the war.

How long do you want the war to last and how high a body count, military and civilian, are you willing to accept?

Would the mass starvation and disease of the Japanese people be acceptable because we didn't use nuclear weapons? Let's say 250k and then maybe double that from Operation Downfall maybe more? Or a 6-9 month extension of the war in Europe? Perhaps both?

I'd prefer not to even be on the position to have to make that choice. But one ends with less suffering and one ends with more suffering. Your hands aren't clean, either way, but that's just the way it is.

When you boil it down, consumption- the idea that a human being is nothing more than the big screens and SUVs he can purchase- is the core of the neoliberal philosophy that is so reviled by such disparate political thinkers as Tall Midget and America.

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

I don't think they chose to be born into that society. And I don't think the objects of women would have made anyone re-think the war strategy. You did what you were told.

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Why are only 14 percent of black CPS 11th-graders proficient in English?

Dolphin starts tire fires and runs away.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

It’s not obviously true, it’s obviously bullshit. You’re simply asking people to ignore any morals they might possess and vote for their team. It’s pretty much the worst, laziest advice I can imagine.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

The only problem is that whatever true working-class support Trump had seems to have been largely ephemeral, and the true never-say-die base that's sustaining the Trump movement is the same old suburban/exurban white guys who fancy themselves the job creators that the Republican Party prioritizes. I agree that that movement he's talking about is coalescing, but not necessarily around Donald Trump. American Baathism -- capitalism where we need it, socialism where we need it, whatever it takes for the glorification of Our People -- will be led by someone else.

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I just did.

I’m not able to control the actions of others.

Killing tens of thousands on innocent women and kids opened the door to the likes of Osama Bin Ladin and others of his ilk.

He says so himself. You can find the interview on YouTube.

Actions like these have negative consequences for centuries.

_________________

I would have to think that's going to happen at some point. It's Islamaphobic otherwise.

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Why are only 14 percent of black CPS 11th-graders proficient in English?

Never happen, you'd have guys marrying dozens of foreigners and making them citizens.

_________________

ToxicMasculinity

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It's actually the complete opposite of that. It's asking a person to stand behind his or her morals in spite of any personal animus toward the only person currently capable of defending said morals.

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

It’s not that at all. It’s telling everyone who is conservative they should support Trump without exception. You’re advocating mindlessness, there’s no other way to spin it.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

That's probably true.

My point is that Trump and Bernie/AOC are minimally paying lip service to the same central issue. They simply offer different prescriptions on how to address it. That's as opposed to someone like Joe Biden and Hillary Clinton, who I still expect to be a late entry, who fantasize about going back to the way things were pre-2016.

_________________
Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

He was a man before his time.

Like the kids toking up in Hatchet's alley.

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First of all, I'm not advocating anything. I'm discussing a position which you are dismissing without thinking it through due to knee-jerk distaste for Donald Trump.

The fact is, right now there is no legitimate Conservative movement outside Trumpism. If you are a Christian you can either support Trump or support a bunch of things to which you claim moral opposition. Those are your two choices. Anything else is fantasyland.

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

Joe Orr Road Rod: serious question.

Is there a prescription, Fantasyland or otherwise, for a return of a robust middle class, that any of these guys have? If not, we have to tax the fuck out of rich people. Plan B is a revolt, which we know will never happen.

If any of these fucknut democrats is going to win it is because we collectively are tired of crying rich people.

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I don't remember half the time if I'm hiding or I'm lost

I'm not sure what the answer is but I would say revolution is eventually inevitable if the hollowing out continues and Jeff Bezos and a few others have all the wealth.

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

That’s nonsense. What is your definition of legitimate? Are you the sole arbiter of legitimacy? The answer is of course not and of course there is a conservative movement independent of Trumpism, which is not itself aligned with Christianity.

And you’re wrong about me dismissing your idea without thinking it through. “Don’t think, just vote for your team” is hardly a novel concept and it’s one which I’ve considered many times and every time found to be wholly without merit or integrity.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Big facts.

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You keep saying that and it's wrong. Trump is not on anyone's "team". These people are being forced to support him in spite of that fact. And I'd like you to point out who the traditional Conservative is who you think can be a legit alternative to Trump.

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Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

Again, who are you defining as legitimate? You seem to be solely dealing in stereotypes and generalities here.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Someone who could win a presidential election.

_________________
Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

Ok so now we’re back to the same unoriginal advocation of the two party system and voting for your team. I’m good.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Are you pretending we don't have a two party system?

_________________
Communists are just people who are terrible at capitalism.

No. I just don’t have much use for people who reinforce it and tell people to vote for the less shitty person.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul