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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:42 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
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I've never said cops only do this to black people. You might wanna take that one up with Seacrest, who believes white people cannot be mistreated by police.


Yet you are comfortable saying this guy is racist. Given only a video of him being a bully with a white kid there. You don't think that's a dangerous message to project?

It's like saying, whites run from black people. They will kill you or beat and torture you:

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/08/23 ... te-people/

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/05/us/c ... video.html

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html

No, I don't think it's dangerous to suggest a white man choking a black kid and threatening to fucking kill him might not have a great opinion of black people. Maybe he's not racist and just has severe anger management issues. Either way, you're acting like this is the equivalent of saying all white people or all cops are racist, which is why you continually push the argument that way instead of addressing this incident.


Because he doesn't want to have an honest discussion. He wants to continue to bring up something that literally no one here is doing.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:43 pm 
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WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
Lies, assertions, or otherwise, WFR is far from the most racist person ever here. That kind of hyperbole just makes discourse impossible.


If I can be called a racist in the least then it means that our public discourse has gone insane.


WFR we've discussed this before but I think one hang-up for you is what I view as your sort of dismissal of lived experience. Yes experiences are subjective and mostly not quantifiable but at the same time they create "truths" that aren't always shared by different people. Here is what you're going up against: Image

Quote:
By large margins, black adults are more likely than whites to say that blacks are treated less fairly than whites across key areas of American life. For example, 64% of black adults say blacks are treated less fairly than whites in the workplace, compared with 22% of whites who say the same – a 42-percentage-point gap. Blacks are also considerably more likely than whites – by margins of at least 20 points – to say that blacks are treated less fairly than whites in dealing with the police, in the courts, when applying for a loan or mortgage, in stores and restaurants and when voting in elections.

Blacks are also more likely than whites to say they have experienced unfair treatment because of their race or ethnicity in the past year. Some 47% of blacks say someone has acted as if they were suspicious of them and 45% say people have acted as if they thought they weren’t smart. About one-in-ten whites report having these types of experiences. Blacks are also more likely than whites to say they have been unfairly stopped by police (18% vs. 3%) and that they have been treated unfairly in hiring, pay or a job promotion (21% vs. 4%) in the last year.


Rather than deny people these feelings I think you should try thinking through why they might be "true" for some as a starting point in the discussions you're trying to have.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:48 pm 
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GoldenJet wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
RR and Nas don't need folks like you, or me, to do their bidding for them.


In no way doing their bidding for them...but absolutely calling out the obvious...It's not only people of color who should be upset.


I wasn't talking to you.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:49 pm 
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WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
I'm still going out on a limb and calling the cop, at the minimum, a bigot and a douchebag. The guy had 2 kids to choose from the grab and throw to the ground...the bleeding white kid sitting on his ??? or the black kid who was doing a wellness check on said white kid.


He targeted a black kid to beat the shit out of? And you are certain he's a bigot? Better tell black kids to just run every time they see a cop.



He had 2 targets to choose from, the white kid, sitting on his property bleeding...or the black kid, not sitting on his property, apparently acting like a sensible human.

I'm quite certain this dude is a bigot, yes.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:50 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
RR and Nas don't need folks like you, or me, to do their bidding for them.


In no way doing their bidding for them...but absolutely calling out the obvious...It's not only people of color who should be upset.


I wasn't talking to you.


So what?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:51 pm 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
I'm still going out on a limb and calling the cop, at the minimum, a bigot and a douchebag. The guy had 2 kids to choose from the grab and throw to the ground...the bleeding white kid sitting on his ??? or the black kid who was doing a wellness check on said white kid.


Wellness check? For all we know he was demanding directions to the nearest defenseless white woman's house!



You can call him whatever you want.

But as a white guy from the North Shore, you come across as self serving.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:51 pm 
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GoldenJet wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
I'm still going out on a limb and calling the cop, at the minimum, a bigot and a douchebag. The guy had 2 kids to choose from the grab and throw to the ground...the bleeding white kid sitting on his ??? or the black kid who was doing a wellness check on said white kid.


He targeted a black kid to beat the shit out of? And you are certain he's a bigot? Better tell black kids to just run every time they see a cop.



He had 2 targets to choose from, the white kid, sitting on his property bleeding...or the black kid, not sitting on his property, apparently acting like a sensible human.

I'm quite certain this dude is a bigot, yes.


You don't seem to understand the definition of the word "certain".

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:53 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
I'm still going out on a limb and calling the cop, at the minimum, a bigot and a douchebag. The guy had 2 kids to choose from the grab and throw to the ground...the bleeding white kid sitting on his ??? or the black kid who was doing a wellness check on said white kid.


Wellness check? For all we know he was demanding directions to the nearest defenseless white woman's house!



You can call him whatever you want.

But as a white guy from the North Shore, you come across as self serving.


???

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:53 pm 
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Nas wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
We live in a country where is this now national news. A married white cop roughly detained a black kid involved in a fight who was trespassing on his property. The cop appeared to be an an empowered bully in the video- certainly, but I would say that it's no longer in a person's self-interest to use force against a black suspect.

We don't know the circumstances prior to the video, but I certainly question whether his primary motivation was racial hatred that trumped his own self-interest. It could be, but if that's your narrative based on just the video you are pushing an agenda.


When does this stupidity end? Why are you hellbent on trying to convince us that no white person is racist? Why do you believe that you are being victimized?


When did I say I was being victimized? I'm the one who believes in facts and evidence. You are the one who believes in invisible facts that we just must cling to. Just assuming racism is the path to a total meltdown. It's automatically assuming that an asshole is only that because of the person's skin. It's neither productive nor hopeful of anything better. And it leads to things like this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/gra ... ea89f61b40

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/09/us/missou ... index.html

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... le/484418/

You want to tell me that the judicial system is racist, as it pertains sentencing. I believe it. You want to say that black people have been put in a terrible economic position because of racism? I agree and say let's look for answers.

To assume that racism is present in police encounters absence of any context other than the race of those involved, and we have entered into dogma.


I've never said this cop was racist. In fact I rarely say anyone is racist. Every week there appears to be a thread where you're trying to convince everyone that whites aren't racist or that n-word is some magical word that everyone should shout. You take some really odd and intellectually dishonest positions. It comes off like you believe the actions of other whites is a reflection on you so you need to defend their behavior or motives.


You are reflecting your own insecurities here. I've attempted an intellectual discussion. Framing everything as a racially motivated action is dangerous cue the links. I'm debating a framing narrative. I don't care about the sanctity of my "race" or whatever bullshit you are trying to turn this into here.


Since literally no one here has said every action of a cop or regular White American is "racially motivated", what is the point of your posts? You continue to accuse me and others of things that aren't true but then you demand that we give white cops and White Anericans the benefit of the doubt. You're full of shit. You're not trying to have an honest discussion. We've had honest discussions on nearly every topic around here.


WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
I've made my point repeatedly. This has been framed as a racially motivated police attack in the media. I've said that it's jumping the gun and dangerous because of several instances of this type of behavior spilling out of control. You resorted to cussing and race baiting because I don't jump to endorse your witch hunt. Carry on.


Your lack of awareness is frightening. This would be hilarious if I believed that you were trolling. Unfortunately you're an aggrieved white man hellbent on fighting some imaginary war. Keep fighting the good fight soldier.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:55 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Regular Reader wrote:
Nas wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
We live in a country where is this now national news. A married white cop roughly detained a black kid involved in a fight who was trespassing on his property. The cop appeared to be an an empowered bully in the video- certainly, but I would say that it's no longer in a person's self-interest to use force against a black suspect.

We don't know the circumstances prior to the video, but I certainly question whether his primary motivation was racial hatred that trumped his own self-interest. It could be, but if that's your narrative based on just the video you are pushing an agenda.


When does this stupidity end? Why are you hellbent on trying to convince us that no white person is racist? Why do you believe that you are being victimized?


Because it fits his usual bigoted narrative . Like when he talked about a "firearm" being recovered. Later amended to state that a bb gun was found

Well, to be fair, ruffcorn is a white suburbanite, and Seacrest said it's racist and offensive for white suburbanites to criticize this cop, so it's sort of a lose/lose here for us white suburbanites I guess.


I said it's racist for you to believe that black posters need you to stand up for them.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:55 pm 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
I'm still going out on a limb and calling the cop, at the minimum, a bigot and a douchebag. The guy had 2 kids to choose from the grab and throw to the ground...the bleeding white kid sitting on his ??? or the black kid who was doing a wellness check on said white kid.


Wellness check? For all we know he was demanding directions to the nearest defenseless white woman's house!



You can call him whatever you want.

But as a white guy from the North Shore, you come across as self serving.


???


Referring to Golden jet.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:56 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
GoldenJet wrote:
I'm still going out on a limb and calling the cop, at the minimum, a bigot and a douchebag. The guy had 2 kids to choose from the grab and throw to the ground...the bleeding white kid sitting on his ??? or the black kid who was doing a wellness check on said white kid.


Wellness check? For all we know he was demanding directions to the nearest defenseless white woman's house!



You can call him whatever you want.

But as a white guy from the North Shore, you come across as self serving.


In what way am I being self serving? Go ahead and define it for me so I understand what you mean.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:57 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Regular Reader wrote:
Nas wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
We live in a country where is this now national news. A married white cop roughly detained a black kid involved in a fight who was trespassing on his property. The cop appeared to be an an empowered bully in the video- certainly, but I would say that it's no longer in a person's self-interest to use force against a black suspect.

We don't know the circumstances prior to the video, but I certainly question whether his primary motivation was racial hatred that trumped his own self-interest. It could be, but if that's your narrative based on just the video you are pushing an agenda.


When does this stupidity end? Why are you hellbent on trying to convince us that no white person is racist? Why do you believe that you are being victimized?


Because it fits his usual bigoted narrative . Like when he talked about a "firearm" being recovered. Later amended to state that a bb gun was found

Well, to be fair, ruffcorn is a white suburbanite, and Seacrest said it's racist and offensive for white suburbanites to criticize this cop, so it's sort of a lose/lose here for us white suburbanites I guess.


I said it's racist for you to believe that black posters need you to stand up for them.

I don't believe that though and I never said or implied I was speaking for anyone other than myself. You might want to rethink your whole "white people cant dislike other white people being racist" premise

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:04 pm 
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FF if you are trying to stand up for me you need to do a better job. You're Sean Spicer and I need Kellyanne Conway.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:07 pm 
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My premise has been clearly stated. You don't have a response so you spout names and outright bs.

Seacrest wrote:
I'm criticizing your calling the cop a racist. I still am.


When you have actual proof, let us know.

Now that Nas and RR have spoken for themselves, you can ice up now son.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:17 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
My premise has been clearly stated. You don't have a response so you spout names and outright bs.

Seacrest wrote:
I'm criticizing your calling the cop a racist. I still am.


When you have actual proof, let us know.

Now that Nas and RR have spoken for themselves, you can ice up now son.


Is what the cop did somehow lessened if he' not a racist?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:18 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
My premise has been clearly stated. You don't have a response so you spout names and outright bs.

Seacrest wrote:
I'm criticizing your calling the cop a racist. I still am.


When you have actual proof, let us know.

Now that Nas and RR have spoken for themselves, you can ice up now son.

You already admitted you can see why it looks like this was racially motivated. You've been all over the place in this thread and keep invoking Nas and RR like they're gonna help you out here. It's pathetic.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:28 pm 
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12 pages and I still don't know why this is even a thread or up for debate. Choked a kid on video. What more do you need to know?

Trollin trollin trollin, keep them posts a rollin.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:34 pm 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
My premise has been clearly stated. You don't have a response so you spout names and outright bs.

Seacrest wrote:
I'm criticizing your calling the cop a racist. I still am.


When you have actual proof, let us know.

Now that Nas and RR have spoken for themselves, you can ice up now son.


Is what the cop did somehow lessened if he' not a racist?



I addressed this earlier.

It's certainly worse if his actions were racially motivated.

Which is why claiming he is a racist was out of bounds, unknown and uneccesary.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:38 pm 
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Seacrest wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
My premise has been clearly stated. You don't have a response so you spout names and outright bs.

Seacrest wrote:
I'm criticizing your calling the cop a racist. I still am.


When you have actual proof, let us know.

Now that Nas and RR have spoken for themselves, you can ice up now son.


Is what the cop did somehow lessened if he' not a racist?



I addressed this earlier.

It's certainly worse if his actions were racially motivated.

Which is why claiming he is a racist was out of bounds, unknown and uneccesary.


So it's bad either way, so what's the BFD?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:12 am 
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Nas wrote:
[
Yeah that would be different. A cop saying that would be helpful and wouldn't be trying to put one of the kids to sleep.


I dunno. I've got an exceedingly quick temper. If I'm a cop and If some kid involved in a neighborhood melee is not cooperating with me, I'm going to lose it real fast. Would have nothing to do with race though. Of course I wouldn't be surprised after the fact when I got fired though.
That is your problem and even more reason to calmly leave.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:19 am 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
My premise has been clearly stated. You don't have a response so you spout names and outright bs.

Seacrest wrote:
I'm criticizing your calling the cop a racist. I still am.


When you have actual proof, let us know.

Now that Nas and RR have spoken for themselves, you can ice up now son.


Is what the cop did somehow lessened if he' not a racist?



I addressed this earlier.

It's certainly worse if his actions were racially motivated.

Which is why claiming he is a racist was out of bounds, unknown and uneccesary.


So it's bad either way, so what's the BFD?


It's pretty simple really.

It's cool for FF to make a snap judgement without all the facts because he felt he knows the intent already.

Just like when cops profiling black people do it.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:41 am 
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Is this the point in the thread where we can discuss the validity of a Jewish state or whether Osama Bin Laden's actions were driven by politics or religion?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:54 am 
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Is this the point in the thread where we can discuss the validity of a Jewish state or whether Osama Bin Laden's actions were driven by politics or religion?


It could be for the ranking of Jimmy Butler.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:54 am 
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veganfan21 wrote:
WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
Lies, assertions, or otherwise, WFR is far from the most racist person ever here. That kind of hyperbole just makes discourse impossible.


If I can be called a racist in the least then it means that our public discourse has gone insane.


WFR we've discussed this before but I think one hang-up for you is what I view as your sort of dismissal of lived experience. Yes experiences are subjective and mostly not quantifiable but at the same time they create "truths" that aren't always shared by different people. Here is what you're going up against: Image

Quote:
By large margins, black adults are more likely than whites to say that blacks are treated less fairly than whites across key areas of American life. For example, 64% of black adults say blacks are treated less fairly than whites in the workplace, compared with 22% of whites who say the same – a 42-percentage-point gap. Blacks are also considerably more likely than whites – by margins of at least 20 points – to say that blacks are treated less fairly than whites in dealing with the police, in the courts, when applying for a loan or mortgage, in stores and restaurants and when voting in elections.

Blacks are also more likely than whites to say they have experienced unfair treatment because of their race or ethnicity in the past year. Some 47% of blacks say someone has acted as if they were suspicious of them and 45% say people have acted as if they thought they weren’t smart. About one-in-ten whites report having these types of experiences. Blacks are also more likely than whites to say they have been unfairly stopped by police (18% vs. 3%) and that they have been treated unfairly in hiring, pay or a job promotion (21% vs. 4%) in the last year.


Rather than deny people these feelings I think you should try thinking through why they might be "true" for some as a starting point in the discussions you're trying to have.


People have feelings so we have to respect them no matter on if they are true or not. You believe this is a healthy perspective?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:05 am 
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Nas wrote:
Your lack of awareness is frightening. This would be hilarious if I believed that you were trolling. Unfortunately you're an aggrieved white man hellbent on fighting some imaginary war. Keep fighting the good fight soldier.


Sure Nas. I'm the one fighting an imaginary war. Look at your signature, and get back to me. My argument has been that we don't know what this man's motivations are, but the media is happy to pile onto the perception that the police are targeting black people due to racial hatred. I believe this to be unhealthy and based on emotion rather than facts. It's a great way to rile people up though. And you feel comfortable being condescending and petty about it. If people hold a differing opinion they are "an aggrieved white man" healthy conversation there.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:11 am 
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WaitingforRuffcorn wrote:
Nas wrote:
Your lack of awareness is frightening. This would be hilarious if I believed that you were trolling. Unfortunately you're an aggrieved white man hellbent on fighting some imaginary war. Keep fighting the good fight soldier.


Sure Nas. I'm the one fighting an imaginary war. Look at your signature, and get back to me. My argument has been that we don't know what this man's motivations are, but the media is happy to pile onto the perception that the police are targeting black people due to racial hatred. I believe this to be unhealthy and based on emotion rather than facts. It's a great way to rile people up though. And you feel comfortable being condescending and petty about it. If people hold a differing opinion they are "an aggrieved white man" healthy conversation there.
Don't want to be called a potential racist? Don't choke and threaten to kill a black teen!

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:54 am 
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Fuck you, Ruffcorn! Stop calling us out on our bullshit! Racist KKK lover!

!


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:10 am 
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ToxicMasculinity wrote:
Is this the point in the thread where we can discuss the validity of a Jewish state or whether Osama Bin Laden's actions were driven by politics or religion?


https://youtu.be/RY7S6EgSlCI

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:12 am 
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pittmike wrote:
ToxicMasculinity wrote:
Is this the point in the thread where we can discuss the validity of a Jewish state or whether Osama Bin Laden's actions were driven by politics or religion?


It could be for the ranking of Jimmy Butler.



Maybe it can be a discussion about out of towners that have a difficult time following local sports franchises? That's sure to light the lamp.

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