I'd feel a lot better if the Bears had somebody other than Ron Turner calling plays.

What he did at Illinois hardly matters in the NFL. And no...I wasn't impressed. His last few Illinois teams sucked so badly, he got fired just three seasons after a BCS bowl game.

He was coordinator for the Bears last year. I don't think I'd call his performance last year a "great job". They were 31st in passing offense. And if they keep running the same kind of predictable sideline go patterns of which they ran a dozen the other night, they are going to be 31st again this year. And as far as what he did ten years ago as Bears OC, it's hardly relevant. I'm a bit more interested in what he's done lately (not much) and what he is going to do with these players.

I know the Bears didn't have a RB and were missing Kreutz Friday night, but I hope that this week they get to work on the running game. There were no spaces to run...zero...when the Bears first team offense was working vs. the Niners' first team defense.

When did I say Griese was the savior? All I have advocated is a fair competition for the starting job between Griese and Grossman. At this point, it's not clear to me who the better QB is, so I'd certainly like to see Griese get some playing time with the starting offense so he can be more accurately compared to Grossman. Why you have overreacted so dramatically to my suggestion is a bit confusing.

Perhaps you do so because there really is, as WR points out, little evidence to support your view. The mockery with which you treat my position is really more logically applicable to your own conclusion about Grossman. You are the one who has adopted an absolutist position based on equivocal evidence and a whole lot of hoping and praying. Indeed, you are the one who has anointed Grossman "the savior" when the most notable attribute he has thus far demonstrated is his ability to get injured. And you are the one who has attempted to conceal the insubstantiality of your argument with exaggerations, distortion and sarcasm.

I agree with you that Griese has demonstrated numerous shortcomings as an NFL quarterback. But Griese's weaknesses don't make Grossman a better alternative since he has many of his own problems (inaccuracy and bad decisions are two of them). Rational fans and coaches should welcome a legitimate competition between the two QBs--may the best man win.

No, this is not what "everyone" is saying. Grossman looked better than Griese in the first few practices, but Lawrence Holmes, John Mullin and Hub Arkush, among others, have said that Griese has caught up and is now frequently performing better than Rex in camp.

As for what people "think" about Rex's potential, that's just speculation and proves nothing.

Nas, I think you're trying to make a point about Griese never making it through a whole season to try to make people think he gets hurt every year and can only muster at best 10 starts in a year. I'd just like to expand upon your comments and say in 2001 Brian Griese started and played in 15 out of the 16 regular season games. In 1999 he started 13 and played in 14. While I agree he doesn't have the Peyton Manning, Brett Favre track record of playing every week, I just want people to realize he isn't Rex Grossman when it comes to playing every week either.

Now thats a stat I'd love to see. How many QBs with 5 or more seasons have actually played in all 16 games of a season (and for how many seasons)? I've got to believe it's a pretty short list.

Get to work...somebody (I'm too lazy)!

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I believe Farve is the only one to match those qualifications.

I don't want to seem like I am crowing Brian Griese the second coming of Christ which I don't believe I am and I don't think anyone has accused me of that yet, but I have to continue this discussion.

First, Griese has played 8 NFL seasons. This will be his ninth.

1998 - He obviously wasn't going to be starting 16 games as he was a rookie.

99 - discussed already

00 - Did get hurt, played 10 games. QB rating was 102.9. I think a Rex supporter trying to dis Griese by saying he can't play 16 games in a season is kind of a funny stab to take at Griese.

01 - 15 out of 16 games started and played

02 - 13 out of 16...Was pushed out of Denver for not being John Elway. I'm not even saying he was a top ten QB, but I don't think he was horrible. He left Denver in 02 with a 85.6 QB Rating

03 - Played for Miami. Was signed not to be the starting QB. Played 5 games.

04 - TB. started 10, played 11. Set the Tampa Bay Buccs record for highest QB rating in a season (i know, not hard to do, but 97.5 is nothing to blow off)

05 - Got the Buccs off to a good start before getting hurt.

What does this all mean? It means, Nas is right. Griese is not proven as far as being able to start every game. What am I trying to prove, that Griese does have a track record of starting more games than Rex Grossman has in any of his years. Griese also has been fairly efficient. To tell me Griese gets hurt and therefore is a reason why he should not be the Bears starting QB makes no sense in my opinion. My question to Nas would then be, why bother starting Rex Grossman. He has a track record of not finishing out a year either. Might as well make Kyle Orton your starter if you are going to knock Griese for durability as a reason for Grossman to start. Again, I'm not declaring Griese to be anything special, but if you told me everything about these two guys and their pasts, but did not give me their names and told me what kind of team the Bears had this year....I would pick Quarterback "B" hands down (Griese). If Griese gets hurt, so be it. Then little Rex can come in, play decent, get hurt, and then Kyle can continue winning football games. I understand Lovie is in a tough position and saying Rex should be the starter is a good thing for Rex Grossman's confidence and future. I just think Lovie having a QB battle for the starting position maybe the best thing...for the Bears.

Manning hasn't missed a game in his entire career.

Nas, I looked back and you never did make that arguement. My bad. Just the fact that you keep telling us Greise hasn't played a full 16 led me to believe you were using that as an arguement for him to not be starter, and Rex to be starter. My bad. I want to keep the integrity of this discussion and misquoting you doesn't do that. My bad.