It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 3:31 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 54 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:56 am
Posts: 32235
Location: A sterile, homogeneous suburb
pizza_Place: Pizza Cucina
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Well, thank you.


But on the other hand, let's not pretend that everything was cool before and this popped up out of nowhere. Decades of sexism are as much to blame as Jezebel.

There are MANY on and off this board who still view women as the weaker sex, etc.

In fact, I think a case could be made that Sexism is more prevalent than racism at this point.


Women are the weaker sex in certain ways. They're also the only sex that can bear a child. Part of the problem is pretending that there is no difference.

Do you think women, especially good looking ones, ever get breaks because of their sex? Is that sexism? I would say it is, but women aren't complaining about that. Life isn't fair. It doesn't go your way all the time. But it doesn't always go against you either.

I thought you would understand that my "weaker" sex was not specifically regarding physical strength. I meant overall.

Would you say that about black people, too? They get scholarships that other races cant get sometimes.

But really, I guess what I'm asking is if we are just wiping the slate clean? Should nothing in our racist/sexist past have any bearing on current times?

You really think thoughts like this article are “wiping the slate clean”?

_________________
Curious Hair wrote:
I'm a big dumb shitlib baby


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
leashyourkids wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Well, thank you.


But on the other hand, let's not pretend that everything was cool before and this popped up out of nowhere. Decades of sexism are as much to blame as Jezebel.

There are MANY on and off this board who still view women as the weaker sex, etc.

In fact, I think a case could be made that Sexism is more prevalent than racism at this point.


Women are the weaker sex in certain ways. They're also the only sex that can bear a child. Part of the problem is pretending that there is no difference.

Do you think women, especially good looking ones, ever get breaks because of their sex? Is that sexism? I would say it is, but women aren't complaining about that. Life isn't fair. It doesn't go your way all the time. But it doesn't always go against you either.

I thought you would understand that my "weaker" sex was not specifically regarding physical strength. I meant overall.

Would you say that about black people, too? They get scholarships that other races cant get sometimes.

But really, I guess what I'm asking is if we are just wiping the slate clean? Should nothing in our racist/sexist past have any bearing on current times?

You really think thoughts like this article are “wiping the slate clean”?

Not at all what I was saying. I didnt even read the article. I know what it says and the tone of it.

My question is, are we prepared to say "yea, we used to be racist and sexist, but we're not anymore so get over it"

If not, we have to at least assign some blame to the past when we absolutely did marginalize women and people of color.

Some of these reactions seem to have a tone like "there is no sexism and there never was, so stop crying"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:34 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:56 am
Posts: 32235
Location: A sterile, homogeneous suburb
pizza_Place: Pizza Cucina
If people can point to specific examples of racism or sexism or discrimination, we combat them. But going on about how women are mistreated in general and men are evil is fucking stupid and absolutely counterproductive.

_________________
Curious Hair wrote:
I'm a big dumb shitlib baby


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 4:29 pm
Posts: 38010
pizza_Place: Lou Malnatis
When was the last time anyone here drove by a car and saw a woman changing the flat tire ?

_________________
Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:36 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:00 am
Posts: 76659
Location: Chicago Heights
pizza_Place: Aurelio's
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Well, thank you.


But on the other hand, let's not pretend that everything was cool before and this popped up out of nowhere. Decades of sexism are as much to blame as Jezebel.

There are MANY on and off this board who still view women as the weaker sex, etc.

In fact, I think a case could be made that Sexism is more prevalent than racism at this point.


Women are the weaker sex in certain ways. They're also the only sex that can bear a child. Part of the problem is pretending that there is no difference.

Do you think women, especially good looking ones, ever get breaks because of their sex? Is that sexism? I would say it is, but women aren't complaining about that. Life isn't fair. It doesn't go your way all the time. But it doesn't always go against you either.

I thought you would understand that my "weaker" sex was not specifically regarding physical strength. I meant overall.

Would you say that about black people, too? They get scholarships that other races cant get sometimes.

But really, I guess what I'm asking is if we are just wiping the slate clean? Should nothing in our racist/sexist past have any bearing on current times?



I don't believe in the concept of collective guilt. I treat others the way I like to be treated. I don't think the fact that some men are scumbags is any reflection on me. Just like I don't think the fact that Hillary Clinton is a horrible person is a reflection an all women. I don't even think it's a reflection on women- or men- who voted for her because of what they thought were good reasons.

_________________
His mind is not for rent to any God or government.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
leashyourkids wrote:
If people can point to specific examples of racism or sexism or discrimination, we combat them. But going on about how women are mistreated in general and men are evil is fucking stupid and absolutely counterproductive.

Combat them?

I agree on the all men are evil part. Very dumb. Not as much on the women are mistreated. I believe they still are in some ways and won't begrudge them pointing it out.


I get an "oh my god, get over it we had a black president/female supreme court justice" vibe from a lot of people. I dont think that's a fair way to look at it.

If the response to that is, well, life aint fair. I agree. That's fine. Apply the same logic when wondering why articles like this exist.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Well, thank you.


But on the other hand, let's not pretend that everything was cool before and this popped up out of nowhere. Decades of sexism are as much to blame as Jezebel.

There are MANY on and off this board who still view women as the weaker sex, etc.

In fact, I think a case could be made that Sexism is more prevalent than racism at this point.


Women are the weaker sex in certain ways. They're also the only sex that can bear a child. Part of the problem is pretending that there is no difference.

Do you think women, especially good looking ones, ever get breaks because of their sex? Is that sexism? I would say it is, but women aren't complaining about that. Life isn't fair. It doesn't go your way all the time. But it doesn't always go against you either.

I thought you would understand that my "weaker" sex was not specifically regarding physical strength. I meant overall.

Would you say that about black people, too? They get scholarships that other races cant get sometimes.

But really, I guess what I'm asking is if we are just wiping the slate clean? Should nothing in our racist/sexist past have any bearing on current times?



I don't believe in the concept of collective guilt. I treat others the way I like to be treated. I don't think the fact that some men are scumbags is any reflection on me. Just like I don't think the fact that Hillary Clinton is a horrible person is a reflection an all women. I don't even think it's a reflection on women- or men- who voted for her because of what they thought were good reasons.

You're focusing on the all men are bad thing. I agree with you there. Id think most sane people do.


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:51 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
badrogue17 wrote:
When was the last time anyone here drove by a car and saw a woman changing the flat tire ?

I would guess I see 50 men for every 1 female doing it.

What is your point, though?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:56 am
Posts: 32235
Location: A sterile, homogeneous suburb
pizza_Place: Pizza Cucina
rogers park bryan wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
If people can point to specific examples of racism or sexism or discrimination, we combat them. But going on about how women are mistreated in general and men are evil is fucking stupid and absolutely counterproductive.

Combat them?

I agree on the all men are evil part. Very dumb. Not as much on the women are mistreated. I believe they still are in some ways and won't begrudge them pointing it out.


I get an "oh my god, get over it we had a black president/female supreme court justice" vibe from a lot of people. I dont think that's a fair way to look at it.

If the response to that is, well, life aint fair. I agree. That's fine. Apply the same logic when wondering why articles like this exist.


Yes, combat them. Encourage those women to sue. Publicly shame the perpetrator. But it has to be specific and not just some dumb reference to patriarchy.

_________________
Curious Hair wrote:
I'm a big dumb shitlib baby


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
leashyourkids wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
If people can point to specific examples of racism or sexism or discrimination, we combat them. But going on about how women are mistreated in general and men are evil is fucking stupid and absolutely counterproductive.

Combat them?

I agree on the all men are evil part. Very dumb. Not as much on the women are mistreated. I believe they still are in some ways and won't begrudge them pointing it out.


I get an "oh my god, get over it we had a black president/female supreme court justice" vibe from a lot of people. I dont think that's a fair way to look at it.

If the response to that is, well, life aint fair. I agree. That's fine. Apply the same logic when wondering why articles like this exist.


Yes, combat them. Encourage those women to sue. Publicly shame the perpetrator. But it has to be specific and not just some dumb reference to patriarchy.

I see. I misread.

Agreed.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:08 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:00 am
Posts: 76659
Location: Chicago Heights
pizza_Place: Aurelio's
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Well, thank you.


But on the other hand, let's not pretend that everything was cool before and this popped up out of nowhere. Decades of sexism are as much to blame as Jezebel.

There are MANY on and off this board who still view women as the weaker sex, etc.

In fact, I think a case could be made that Sexism is more prevalent than racism at this point.


Women are the weaker sex in certain ways. They're also the only sex that can bear a child. Part of the problem is pretending that there is no difference.

Do you think women, especially good looking ones, ever get breaks because of their sex? Is that sexism? I would say it is, but women aren't complaining about that. Life isn't fair. It doesn't go your way all the time. But it doesn't always go against you either.

I thought you would understand that my "weaker" sex was not specifically regarding physical strength. I meant overall.

Would you say that about black people, too? They get scholarships that other races cant get sometimes.

But really, I guess what I'm asking is if we are just wiping the slate clean? Should nothing in our racist/sexist past have any bearing on current times?



I don't believe in the concept of collective guilt. I treat others the way I like to be treated. I don't think the fact that some men are scumbags is any reflection on me. Just like I don't think the fact that Hillary Clinton is a horrible person is a reflection an all women. I don't even think it's a reflection on women- or men- who voted for her because of what they thought were good reasons.

You're focusing on the all men are bad thing. I agree with you there. Id think most sane people do.


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


That article isn't pointing out sexism though. It's a guy who thinks he's an "ally" virtue signalling that he (and you and me, etc.) is a piece of shit because he was born with balls into a world where some men with balls act shitty.

_________________
His mind is not for rent to any God or government.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:10 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:30 am
Posts: 1497
pizza_Place: Bianchis
rogers park bryan wrote:


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


Yes, it is right to point out racism and sexism when it occurs. The problem lies in perceptions. I would argue that some, not all, but some of what is portrayed as racist or sexist comments/actions/words are people really fishing and seeking out said offense for the sake of being offended.

I think society as a whole tends to bitch about more minute things as things get better. It's like comparing the poor people in this country versus the poor people in Botswana. Whose lot in life is better? Same with racism and sexism. Will all sexism and racism be eradicated at some point? Not a chance. Humans are different inside and out in a multitude of ways, and people have opinions and biases. So since things are much better now compared to one hundred or even twenty years ago, I would argue, I think people who have an inherent nature to want to be offended search harder and harder to find ways to be offended or point out the systemic racist/sexist/any other -ist that is plaguing our society.

_________________
Curious Hair wrote:
Ah, Lemonparty, the 8th sacrament.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Well, thank you.


But on the other hand, let's not pretend that everything was cool before and this popped up out of nowhere. Decades of sexism are as much to blame as Jezebel.

There are MANY on and off this board who still view women as the weaker sex, etc.

In fact, I think a case could be made that Sexism is more prevalent than racism at this point.


Women are the weaker sex in certain ways. They're also the only sex that can bear a child. Part of the problem is pretending that there is no difference.

Do you think women, especially good looking ones, ever get breaks because of their sex? Is that sexism? I would say it is, but women aren't complaining about that. Life isn't fair. It doesn't go your way all the time. But it doesn't always go against you either.

I thought you would understand that my "weaker" sex was not specifically regarding physical strength. I meant overall.

Would you say that about black people, too? They get scholarships that other races cant get sometimes.

But really, I guess what I'm asking is if we are just wiping the slate clean? Should nothing in our racist/sexist past have any bearing on current times?



I don't believe in the concept of collective guilt. I treat others the way I like to be treated. I don't think the fact that some men are scumbags is any reflection on me. Just like I don't think the fact that Hillary Clinton is a horrible person is a reflection an all women. I don't even think it's a reflection on women- or men- who voted for her because of what they thought were good reasons.

You're focusing on the all men are bad thing. I agree with you there. Id think most sane people do.


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


That article isn't pointing out sexism though. It's a guy who thinks he's an "ally" virtue signalling that he (and you and me, etc.) is a piece of shit because he was born with balls into a world where some men with balls act shitty.

I know. The article is stupid. Im expanding the conversation.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:50 pm
Posts: 6721
pizza_Place: Parts Unknown
The Root is a crime against journalism.

_________________
Terry's Peeps wrote:
Have a terrible night and die in MANY fires.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
SuperMario wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


Yes, it is right to point out racism and sexism when it occurs. The problem lies in perceptions. I would argue that some, not all, but some of what is portrayed as racist or sexist comments/actions/words are people really fishing and seeking out said offense for the sake of being offended.

There is no question that some are fishing or completely without warrant, but it's like rape victims. Are you going to interrogate rape victims because others have lied in the past?

I would say, judge each instance on it's merit.


Dont be like :roll: another female "victim"

It's akin to saying RACE CARD to any claim of racism.



SuperMario wrote:
I would argue, I think people who have an inherent nature to want to be offended search harder and harder to find ways to be offended or point out the systemic racist/sexist/any other -ist that is plaguing our society.

Certainly some truth to that.

That's a pretty deep rabbit hole and whole other conversation.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:37 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:17 am
Posts: 72289
Location: Palatine
pizza_Place: Lou Malnatis
Didn't realize so many posters here preferred men over women.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:30 am
Posts: 1497
pizza_Place: Bianchis
rogers park bryan wrote:
SuperMario wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


Yes, it is right to point out racism and sexism when it occurs. The problem lies in perceptions. I would argue that some, not all, but some of what is portrayed as racist or sexist comments/actions/words are people really fishing and seeking out said offense for the sake of being offended.

There is no question that some are fishing or completely without warrant, but it's like rape victims. Are you going to interrogate rape victims because others have lied in the past?

I would say, judge each instance on it's merit.


Dont be like :roll: another female "victim"

It's akin to saying RACE CARD to any claim of racism.


That was the point I was trying to make. I agree that each should be judged on its own merit. I think we agree on that but are coming at it from different sides. I don't think every claimed thing is automatically racist or sexist. I don't follow the Hillary mantra of "Trust all women" (Except those who accuse Bill).

One of the best things Betsy Devos has done is reintroduce due process into Title IX investigations. I don't think it downplays any sexual harassment or assaults on campuses as some women claim. I think it gives each allegation a fair investigation and not an automatic guilty assumption.

_________________
Curious Hair wrote:
Ah, Lemonparty, the 8th sacrament.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81627
SuperMario wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
SuperMario wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:


Im asking, is it ever ok to point out sexism?

Im not saying you, but there are many that auto eye roll at any mention of sexism/racism.


Yes, it is right to point out racism and sexism when it occurs. The problem lies in perceptions. I would argue that some, not all, but some of what is portrayed as racist or sexist comments/actions/words are people really fishing and seeking out said offense for the sake of being offended.

There is no question that some are fishing or completely without warrant, but it's like rape victims. Are you going to interrogate rape victims because others have lied in the past?

I would say, judge each instance on it's merit.


Dont be like :roll: another female "victim"

It's akin to saying RACE CARD to any claim of racism.


That was the point I was trying to make. I agree that each should be judged on its own merit. I think we agree on that but are coming at it from different sides. I don't think every claimed thing is automatically racist or sexist. I don't follow the Hillary mantra of "Trust all women" (Except those who accuse Bill).
.

Maybe you didnt mean to imply that I believe all claims of racism/sexism but just want to point out the post you quoted, I literally said
There is no question that some are fishing or completely without warrant


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:30 am
Posts: 1497
pizza_Place: Bianchis
Sorry. That was not what I thought you meant.

I just meant that you were coming at it from the side of not overlooking or eyerolling claims on the basis that some other claims are without merit. That is my ultimate belief/point as well, but I was just coming at it from the viewpoint that claims should be investigated and not all claims should be trusted at will. Same point, just different emphasis.

_________________
Curious Hair wrote:
Ah, Lemonparty, the 8th sacrament.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 3:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 11:10 am
Posts: 42094
Location: Rock Ridge (splendid!)
pizza_Place: Charlie Fox's / Paisano's
FavreFan wrote:
Didn't realize so many posters here preferred men over women.

After all these years, do you finally feel accepted around here then?

_________________
Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 3:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:29 pm
Posts: 34796
pizza_Place: Al's Pizza
FavreFan wrote:
Didn't realize so many posters here preferred men over women.


Homer: That John is the greatest guy in the world. We got to have him and his wife over for drinks sometime.

Marge: Mmm, I don't think he's married, Homer.

Homer: Oh, a swingin' bachelor, eh? Well, there's lots of foxy ladies out there.

Marge: Homer, didn't John seem a little festive to you?

Homer: Couldn't agree more. Happy as a clam.

Marge: He prefers the company of men.

Homer: Who doesn't?

Marge: Homer, listen carefully. John is a homo-

Homer: Right.

Marge: -sexual.

Homer: Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I danced with a gay. Marge, Lisa, promise me you won't tell anyone.

_________________
Good people drink good beer - Hunter S. Thompson

<º)))><

Waiting for the time when I can finally say
That this has all been wonderful, but now I'm on my way


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:15 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2016 3:24 pm
Posts: 16901
pizza_Place: Pequods
If more articles like this come out, BRick can be converted into becoming a shitlord

_________________
“When I walked in this morning, and saw the flag was at half mast, I thought 'alright another bureaucrat ate it.'" - Ron Swanson


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:55 pm
Posts: 31935
Location: Wrigley
pizza_Place: Warren Buffet of Cock
FavreFan wrote:
Didn't realize so many posters here preferred men over women.


Did you see our numbering in the Jurko divorce thread? And MANY are arguing for the "wild woman" who has a distinct chance of being a man. It is getting strangely gay in the land of the gays.

_________________
Hawaii (fuck) You


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 11:10 am
Posts: 42094
Location: Rock Ridge (splendid!)
pizza_Place: Charlie Fox's / Paisano's
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
If more articles like this come out, BRick can be converted into becoming a shitlord

BRick's gonna be Emperor Palpatine?

_________________
Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 54 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group