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Going back to old days
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Author:  Beebo [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Going back to old days
How many of you think the old days of rasslin' can't be brought back, the genie's out of the bag, etc., etc.?

Back in the day, promotions like Memphis garnered incredible ratings off of TV. Something like the 20s, on a week-in, week-out basis. They were able to two crews simultaneously, and have weekly shows that sell out their venues. Promotions would ship their programs from TV station to TV station, effectively a "bicycle network."

Ask yourself: how many of the fans knew wrestling was fake? Answer: nearly all of them. Although most were concerned with how "real" moves looked, versus pre-determined results & scripted feuds.

So, if you lived in Birmingham, AL, watch the TV show, just so happen to drive to Mobile next week, only to find the same program's been shipped to that TV station, you wouldn't think it strange? You wouldn't figure out the pattern? Gee, how many truck & bus drivers are also fans? Think word wouldn't get out?

People say its because there isn't as many TV stations back then. Hmm, I'm the type of person who'd turn the TV off if there's nothing on. What? Nothing's on, so I'm going to watch wrestling instead of going outside, or reading a book? And shoot, even in a small area there's still the three networks. So there's usually 3 stations that come in, of varying quality. Even if I didn't like wrestling and were watching just because the TV's on, and that's what I do.. there are 2 other stations I could have been "parked" on, instead.

20+ TV shares. That's a lot of disinterested viewers, waiting for the Road Runner show to come on... I don't buy that and neither should you. (Yes the Road Runner's worth watching, too.)

Furthermore, a lot of these TV choices now are infomercial stations, DIY home improvement shit, Weather Channel and the like. If you're tuned into that, and feeling suicidal, you'll remain tuned into that. Seriously, if the same percentage of people were interested in wrestling again, they'd be watching on whatever channel it's on, and it doesn't matter how many other channels you have. You're not keeping people away just because there's an "Iron Chef" marathon running on channel 309. If you think that, explain why American Idol and Dancing with Stars do so well in the era of 100s of channels. Answer: they're tuned on American Idol because they want to watch... American Idol. And if they wanted "Iron Chef" instead, there's a marathon over on 309.

Bottom line: people knew wrestling was fake, where entertained in spite of (or, because of) and went in droves. You give them the same sort of angles and they can be just as intrigued.

One thing: MMA is said to be doing everything wrestling did "right" in the 70s and 80s. Now, I'm not a big fan; they do have matches where the contestants are credible, and there's no ref bumps or Dusty Screw Jobs. But I don't see the promos, I don't see storylines/feuds. Maybe they do all that shit on Twitter now, and I just don't notice that part of the equation.

Anyhow, thoughts? Insults? Insulting thoughts?
Author:  Terry's Peeps [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
You smell.

:D

But anyway, independent wrestling is still viable. I just don't think it will ever get back to where it was in the 70s and 80s.

Maybe Resistance Pro getting a tv deal here will prove me wrong. I hope so.
Author:  chaspoppcap [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
There is an easy way a wrestling promotion could be competitive with WWE, real simple and not need a lot of money to start up.

1) Long range scripting of angles. None of this one/two month hot shot booking. You need a beginning ,middle and end to every feud. I know some people do not like to hear this but prowrestling is basically a soap opera for men.It is at it's best when it is telling a story that makes logic and flows smoothly.
2) Define the good guys and the bad guys. Sure there can be one or two tweeners like Stone Cold. Most of the talent should be white hat or black hat. Also,they need to lock in that role for the long term , not flip flop every other month.
3) Max 6 PPV per year.It may seem to limit revenue but it will work in the opposite way in that it will lead to easier long range planning/booking.


This can all be done with unknown talent in that you can build up the characters from scratch. You can bring in a few well known stars using them to build up the new guys. Limiting the stars influence and power in the process.
Author:  Terry's Peeps [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
It isn't that simple.

There are plenty of indy promotions that do what you're suggesting and are no competition.

Ring of Honor
CHIKARA
Dragons Gate
Evolve

It won't happen.
Author:  Beebo [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
No, ROH doesn't book angles. They book matches. If I wanted to know why xx has heat with yy, there's not too much to go by. Steen is the closest we got to a booked feud, and that's against Cornette. There's no payback from that. Beating Corny hurts the "commissioner" position.

Dragon Gate, I don't know...
Author:  Terry's Peeps [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 6:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
I meant more of the original ROH, but even now haven't they booked an angle around Kevin Steen being "fired" and feuding with Corny?
Author:  Bob Loblaw [ Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
chaspoppcap wrote:
There is an easy way a wrestling promotion could be competitive with WWE, real simple and not need a lot of money to start up.

1) Long range scripting of angles. None of this one/two month hot shot booking. You need a beginning ,middle and end to every feud. I know some people do not like to hear this but prowrestling is basically a soap opera for men.It is at it's best when it is telling a story that makes logic and flows smoothly.
2) Define the good guys and the bad guys. Sure there can be one or two tweeners like Stone Cold. Most of the talent should be white hat or black hat. Also,they need to lock in that role for the long term , not flip flop every other month.
3) Max 6 PPV per year.It may seem to limit revenue but it will work in the opposite way in that it will lead to easier long range planning/booking.


This can all be done with unknown talent in that you can build up the characters from scratch. You can bring in a few well known stars using them to build up the new guys. Limiting the stars influence and power in the process.


1) I'm a fan a long angles too and would prefer it, but as said ROH gets by on matches and mostly short angles. The rest as far as storytelling, yes definitely.
2) 100%. I think one of the best (and easiest) angles is when you u turn a guy/girl. Of course add managers, divas as valets, etc. At least it looks like they've started to do this (aj, rosa, vicki, abraham wash). I've whined about this for years and they've finally started doing it, so kudos to them.
3) makes sense to me.

Chikara and DragonGate is nothing but angles and feuds, especially Chikara. It's basically a living comic book so they're all angles, stories, etc. Evolve has a leaderboard and a points system, so in theory every match counts. If this takes off, expect Bischoff to revert back and take credit for the awa team challenge series. ROH has a lot of angles. They had the Generico vs Steen feud that was over a year, had the loser leaves town match and Steen did stay out over a year (unlike Juan Cena who stayed out 48 hours in that Nexus deal) and is now back feuding with Cornette/Davey. They had Briscoes vs Kings of Wresting angle that went for months, Davey vs Eddie mentor - protege deal, Future Shock split up, ciampa chasing the tv title, Jimmy jacobs has an angle. They have a lot of angles and then some randomness mixed in too at each ppv. Best of both worlds in my book.

I always wondered if Vince could get back to 5.0's and I don't think so now, based on the ratings before and after Rumble and Mania. Throw in record low ratings and ppv buys in 2011 and if rock and brock can't pop 4.0, i don't think we'll get 5.0. I agree if there's wrestling fans out there, they'll find it, no matter how many channels - there just may be a finite # of fans. I think there's too many other alternatives outside of tv is the main factor. All of that "back in our day, we didn't have x, y, z" stuff applies big time in this one. Kids just have soooo many alternatives these days. We couldn't even fathom cell phones, the internet, video games, all of that stuff our ADD society has as options these days. I'm not anti-tech by any means, but i preferred a slower-paced society. The quicker it gets, the more alternatives there are, the more wwe dies a little each day.
Author:  Beebo [ Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
Terry's Peeps wrote:
I meant more of the original ROH, but even now haven't they booked an angle around Kevin Steen being "fired" and feuding with Corny?


Yes. As I said, that's the closest to an angle ROH is doing.
Author:  Beebo [ Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
My idea of an angle is someone being called yellow, and then is subsequently spray-painted. These are the kind of things that bring people in: the "gotta see" angles. Hair matches used to be great draws back in the day.

I don't know about Vince. As your buddy Karl Stern said, he's just not interested in Cena, thinks Orton is boring... I agree with his POV, except I began not caring about the talent with Hogan, Savage, Piper.
Author:  Bob Loblaw [ Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
That would be awesome. The most recent "must see" angles i can think were kind of reality based so maybe that's the route. Then again, those didn't do much for ratings in the short or long term. The nexus vs Cena destroy the ring thing, the punk "shoot" promo. I liked the Age of the Fall hanging jay briscoe from the ceiling angle too. Sad to see when Frankie K AND Roode both cut their hair and you don't get a hair match. They've both had long hair their entire careers and Frankie was even let go from wwf because he wouldn't cut his hair and tna does NOTHING with it?
Author:  Beebo [ Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Going back to old days
There's always something "outrageous" that pushes the buttons of the general populace. Hunt one down and do it. Give people a reason to care! Even the Stone Cold angle was good and long term. The thing to have done is find a way not to punish Vince weekly, in case some of us get tired of seeing his lame carcass. Set up Sgt Slaughter as a toady road agent, for example...
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