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 Post subject: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:09 pm 
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NFL is investigating the Raiders for violating it.

The rule seems like a good idea in theory but not in application. I think the hiring of Gruden was dumb but that was their guy. If Belichick became available and said he wanted to coach the Giants it would be embarrassing for all involved to have to go through the charade of interviewing others before hiring him.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:22 pm 
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I think it's a bullshit rule that doesn't really help minority coaches. The league is still 70% minority but like 15% of the coaches are. Hire the guy you want to hire. Don't waste folks time.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:28 pm 
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Isn't one of the very points of the rule though that the amount of teams having "their guy" already in place resulted in a dearth of minority coaches? How often has it been the case that a minority candidates was also seen as the locked-in coach in a comparable manner?

Personally I think it's insufficient and if applied should absolutely be instituted at the coordinator level as well (since one of the very reasons there aren't many qualified minority candidates in the first place is their exclusion further down at the assistant coach level). That being said, everyone knew what the rule was and the Raiders shouldn't get a pass because of their history or some other justification along those lines, as I've heard on ESPN repeatedly today.


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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:38 pm 
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ZephMarshack wrote:
Isn't one of the very points of the rule though that the amount of teams having "their guy" already in place resulted in a dearth of minority coaches? How often has it been the case that a minority candidates was also seen as the locked-in coach in a comparable manner?

Personally I think it's insufficient and if applied should absolutely be instituted at the coordinator level as well (since one of the very reasons there aren't many qualified minority candidates in the first place is their exclusion further down at the assistant coach level). That being said, everyone knew what the rule was and the Raiders shouldn't get a pass because of their history or some other justification along those lines, as I've heard on ESPN repeatedly today.

Yes. But this rule doesn’t correct that and actively embarrasses minority candidates along the way.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:40 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Isn't one of the very points of the rule though that the amount of teams having "their guy" already in place resulted in a dearth of minority coaches? How often has it been the case that a minority candidates was also seen as the locked-in coach in a comparable manner?

Personally I think it's insufficient and if applied should absolutely be instituted at the coordinator level as well (since one of the very reasons there aren't many qualified minority candidates in the first place is their exclusion further down at the assistant coach level). That being said, everyone knew what the rule was and the Raiders shouldn't get a pass because of their history or some other justification along those lines, as I've heard on ESPN repeatedly today.

Yes. But this rule doesn’t correct that and actively embarrasses minority candidates along the way.

What do you propose that would correct it? And I don't see how being unable to interview altogether is more desirable than at least getting a foot in the door even if just for the sake of appearances (which Oakland apparently couldn't even be bothered to do here).


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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:43 pm 
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ZephMarshack wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Isn't one of the very points of the rule though that the amount of teams having "their guy" already in place resulted in a dearth of minority coaches? How often has it been the case that a minority candidates was also seen as the locked-in coach in a comparable manner?

Personally I think it's insufficient and if applied should absolutely be instituted at the coordinator level as well (since one of the very reasons there aren't many qualified minority candidates in the first place is their exclusion further down at the assistant coach level). That being said, everyone knew what the rule was and the Raiders shouldn't get a pass because of their history or some other justification along those lines, as I've heard on ESPN repeatedly today.

Yes. But this rule doesn’t correct that and actively embarrasses minority candidates along the way.

What do you propose that would correct it? And I don't see how being unable to interview altogether is more desirable than at least getting a foot in the door even if just for the sake of appearances (which Oakland apparently couldn't even be bothered to do here).

I think your coordinator idea is good.

I disagree on the sake of appearances point. I’d be enraged at being used as a prop to satisfy a regulation. And the shitty thing is the candidate would still have to show up and go through the motions in order to not burn bridges.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:47 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Isn't one of the very points of the rule though that the amount of teams having "their guy" already in place resulted in a dearth of minority coaches? How often has it been the case that a minority candidates was also seen as the locked-in coach in a comparable manner?

Personally I think it's insufficient and if applied should absolutely be instituted at the coordinator level as well (since one of the very reasons there aren't many qualified minority candidates in the first place is their exclusion further down at the assistant coach level). That being said, everyone knew what the rule was and the Raiders shouldn't get a pass because of their history or some other justification along those lines, as I've heard on ESPN repeatedly today.

Yes. But this rule doesn’t correct that and actively embarrasses minority candidates along the way.

What do you propose that would correct it? And I don't see how being unable to interview altogether is more desirable than at least getting a foot in the door even if just for the sake of appearances (which Oakland apparently couldn't even be bothered to do here).

I think your coordinator idea is good.

I disagree on the sake of appearances point. I’d be enraged at being used as a prop to satisfy a regulation. And the shitty thing is the candidate would still have to show up and go through the motions in order to not burn bridges.


You both make good points, let's move on

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:48 am 
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You guys are missing some important points: 1) It is incredibly important to gain experience in interviewing for unique jobs even if the interview ends up being purely informational. It will provide you the tools you need to hit it out of the park when a more legitimate interview arises. 2) An impressive interview may not result in getting hired if a team walks in with its guy in place. However, word gets out to other teams and the interviewer remembers you for the next hire. 3) Simply having your name published as being interviewed provides you some legitimacy across the league, a league that is copycat in its movements.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:54 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
You guys are missing some important points: 1) It is incredibly important to gain experience in interviewing for unique jobs even if the interview ends up being purely informational. It will provide you the tools you need to hit it out of the park when a more legitimate interview arises. 2) An impressive interview may not result in getting hired if a team walks in with its guy in place. However, word gets out to other teams and the interviewer remembers you for the next hire. 3) Simply having your name published as being interviewed provides you some legitimacy across the league, a league that is copycat in its movements.


Who are these guys that are being remembered besides Tomlin? I may be wrong but I don't think there are more minority coaches to day than there were 10 years ago. It's all a waste of time. A GM or owner will hire a guy they like or feel comfortable with 9 out of 10 times.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:21 pm 
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so we had 2 or 3 before the rooney rule and now we have 7-8 after the rooney rule. thats a good number from a percentage, but i don't believe these are coming as a result of the rooney rule. i believe this coincides more with the fact that dungy created an enormously successful coaching tree that just happens to be full of minorities. Frazier, lovie, herm, tomlin, caldwell. obviously only a few are still in there but i think that jump started it more so than some regulation. as such, since that rule, its stagnated at 7-8.

that said, i think the reality is that in the past , most head coaches never played in the nfl so using how many black players there are in the nfl isn't a good statistic to compare. I think often many coaches are guys who couldn't perform on the field but had the knowledge.

I think the acute complexity of football offenses and defenses has forced players to become much more scheme intelligent to where now they can now coach.


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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:25 am 
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What about black coaches..coaching better?


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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:06 pm 
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I read an interview with James Franklin that he has never looked at a resume when hiring a coach. He simply goes by people he either knows or people that are recommended by those he trust. Granted it is college and NFL but I am assuming it is very similar at the professional level.

Quote:
Franklin: Your résumé means nothing. I’ve never looked at a résumé, ever. Your references mean nothing. I’m not calling your references, I’m calling the people that I know. I’m not working with someone 16-to-17 hours a day if I don’t know them or someone that I trust knows them.


http://footballscoop.com/news/resume-me ... eer-forum/

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:24 pm 
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White coaches, as inferior athletes, may have been winnowed out of actual play sooner and thus have less CTE.

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 Post subject: Re: Rooney Rule
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:50 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
White coaches, as inferior athletes, may have been winnowed out of actual play sooner and thus have less CTE.


*Mike Singletary drops pants*

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