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Herbert > Purdy?
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Author:  Nardi [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nas wrote:
Nardi wrote:
He will be better than Stroud by what metric or metrics?


Better overall stats and more wins.

Better than this year Stroud or next year Stroud?
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nardi wrote:
Nas wrote:
Nardi wrote:
He will be better than Stroud by what metric or metrics?


Better overall stats and more wins.

Better than this year Stroud or next year Stroud?


Both overall. More wins, touchdowns, total yards, and QBR.
Author:  Nardi [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nas wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Nas wrote:
Nardi wrote:
He will be better than Stroud by what metric or metrics?


Better overall stats and more wins.

Better than this year Stroud or next year Stroud?


Both overall. More wins, touchdowns, total yards, and QBR.

Are you going to average Stroud's two years against Williams' one year?
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nardi wrote:
Nas wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Nas wrote:
Nardi wrote:
He will be better than Stroud by what metric or metrics?


Better overall stats and more wins.

Better than this year Stroud or next year Stroud?


Both overall. More wins, touchdowns, total yards, and QBR.

Are you going to average Stroud's two years against Williams' one year?


Nope. I think he'll put up better numbers than Stroud in both. I actually expect Stroud to take a step back. I think C-Will will likely have more turnovers, but that's the only area where I don't believe he can be better than Stroud.
Author:  FavreFan [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Purdy will be revealed as a mid-tier game manager in the SB.

Purdy is a hard guy to evaluate, specifically because hes not a game manager. He's a risk taker, but he's not as good as the typical risk takers like Josh Allen.
Author:  FavreFan [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
This Ends in Antioch wrote:
Fields for the 31st overall?

The cult gets a win in that their guy goes to a team with a stacked roster and great offensive coach. Bears get a slightly better pick than the 2nd most people seem to think he’s worth.

Win-win-win.

I doubt the 49ers would even give up a 6th round pick for Fields
Author:  veganfan21 [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
FavreFan wrote:
This Ends in Antioch wrote:
Fields for the 31st overall?

The cult gets a win in that their guy goes to a team with a stacked roster and great offensive coach. Bears get a slightly better pick than the 2nd most people seem to think he’s worth.

Win-win-win.

I doubt the 49ers would even give up a 6th round pick for Fields


Shanahan wouldn't give his sixth mountain bike for Fields. They hard passed on him in 2021. They got their own pick wrong but they weren't wrong for passing on Fields either.
Author:  FavreFan [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
It all depends on how much money Purdy wants. You can win a Super Bowl with him at a reasonable price. You can't give him the type of contract that future HOF QB Jordan Love is going to get though.

Why would Purdy take less money than the market value for a top player at the position? Unless he completely falls apart next season, odds are his extension will exceed Love’s.

Love is certainly going to get paid more than Purdy
Author:  FavreFan [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Caller Bob wrote:
Brick wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Brick wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
I believe Stafford proved he is in the top tier.

Yeah, because he won a Super Bowl. :lol:

Which you know, Purdy was like one play not having anything to do with him from also doing.


Stafford and Purdy are not even remarkably comparable players. You know this.

I was always a big Stafford fan. You thought he was average until he won a Super Bowl.

Again, the fact that Purdy isn't as good as Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes doesn't mean he can't win a Super Bowl if paid at a reasonable rate.


No, that was FavreFan

We were both wrong about Stafford. I have no problem admitting it. Seems like you do.
Author:  Caller Bob [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
FavreFan wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Brick wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Brick wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
I believe Stafford proved he is in the top tier.

Yeah, because he won a Super Bowl. :lol:

Which you know, Purdy was like one play not having anything to do with him from also doing.


Stafford and Purdy are not even remarkably comparable players. You know this.

I was always a big Stafford fan. You thought he was average until he won a Super Bowl.

Again, the fact that Purdy isn't as good as Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes doesn't mean he can't win a Super Bowl if paid at a reasonable rate.


No, that was FavreFan

We were both wrong about Stafford. I have no problem admitting it. Seems like you do.


Dean, let's check the replay...


viewtopic.php?f=100&t=126779

Looks like you tucked and ran once your awful take went south...
Author:  FavreFan [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 1:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
FavreFan wrote:
We were both wrong about Stafford. I have no problem admitting it. Seems like you do.


Your turn
Author:  Caller Bob [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 2:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
You first
Author:  Zippy-The-Pinhead [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
FavreFan wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
It all depends on how much money Purdy wants. You can win a Super Bowl with him at a reasonable price. You can't give him the type of contract that future HOF QB Jordan Love is going to get though.

Why would Purdy take less money than the market value for a top player at the position? Unless he completely falls apart next season, odds are his extension will exceed Love’s.

Love is certainly going to get paid more than Purdy

We’ll see. Love will set the market this season and Purdy will look to beat it the following (assuming he has a similar year as this one). It happens every season.
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 2:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
I would take Purdy over Love. I think we've overrated Love and Stroud. I've see Stroud as a top 5 quarterback. I don't think he's better than Love. I certainly don't believe Love is top 5.
Author:  Hawg Ass [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nas wrote:
I would take Purdy over Love. I think we've overrated Love and Stroud. I've see Stroud as a top 5 quarterback. I don't think he's better than Love. I certainly don't believe Love is top 5.

Shouldn’t we let them play a little before declarations are made?
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
I would take Purdy over Love. I think we've overrated Love and Stroud. I've see Stroud as a top 5 quarterback. I don't think he's better than Love. I certainly don't believe Love is top 5.

Shouldn’t we let them play a little before declarations are made?


Prognosticating is boring when things are settled. I prefer to get out in front of things. I would rather someone laugh at a wrong prediction of mine than claim that I believed something after the fact.
Author:  Hawg Ass [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nas wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
I would take Purdy over Love. I think we've overrated Love and Stroud. I've see Stroud as a top 5 quarterback. I don't think he's better than Love. I certainly don't believe Love is top 5.

Shouldn’t we let them play a little before declarations are made?


Prognosticating is boring when things are settled. I prefer to get out in front of things. I would rather someone laugh at a wrong prediction of mine than claim that I believed something after the fact.

I laugh a lot then.
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
I would take Purdy over Love. I think we've overrated Love and Stroud. I've see Stroud as a top 5 quarterback. I don't think he's better than Love. I certainly don't believe Love is top 5.

Shouldn’t we let them play a little before declarations are made?


Prognosticating is boring when things are settled. I prefer to get out in front of things. I would rather someone laugh at a wrong prediction of mine than claim that I believed something after the fact.

I laugh a lot then.


Image
Author:  veganfan21 [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
What's your beef with Stroud, nas. MVP consideration, multiple comeback wins with huge fourth quarter throws, playoff appearance, etc, all in his first year where he doesn't know anything and hasn't seen anything. Why so down on him?
Author:  Hussra [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Image
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
veganfan21 wrote:
What's your beef with Stroud, nas. MVP consideration, multiple comeback wins with huge fourth quarter throws, playoff appearance, etc, all in his first year where he doesn't know anything and hasn't seen anything. Why so down on him?


I have no beef with him. I have no beef with Love beyond being a Packer. I simply don't believe they're as good as the hype. The Texans were winning games because of their defense, not Stroud. If C-Will has only 23 passing touchdowns next year, I'll be disappointed.
Author:  Hussra [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Stroud missed 2 games, 23 TD in 15 games was good enough to tie Hurts (who played all 17 ) for 13th in total TDs at 23, with most players above Stroud playing another game or two. Mahomes had 27 TD in 16 games.

Only Dak (36), Love (32), Brock Mid (31) and Goff (30) >= 30 TD
Author:  Zippy-The-Pinhead [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
What's your beef with Stroud, nas. MVP consideration, multiple comeback wins with huge fourth quarter throws, playoff appearance, etc, all in his first year where he doesn't know anything and hasn't seen anything. Why so down on him?


I have no beef with him. I have no beef with Love beyond being a Packer. I simply don't believe they're as good as the hype. The Texans were winning games because of their defense, not Stroud. If C-Will has only 23 passing touchdowns next year, I'll be disappointed.

Prepare to be disappointed. C-Will won’t touch these numbers as a rookie, even if he is good.

Stroud finished his rookie season completing 63.9% of his passes for 4,108 yards with 23 touchdowns to five interceptions for a 100.8 passer rating, leading the NFL in pass yards per game (274) and having the lowest interception rate (1.0%).
Author:  veganfan21 [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Not sure about that, nas. They averaged 5.7 more points per game than they did last year. Why? That's all Stroud. That per game increase has them ranked 14 overall in offense dvoa. On defense they ranked 17, just behind the bears. Stroud was the primary driver of their turnaround.
Author:  Caller Bob [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
What's your beef with Stroud, nas. MVP consideration, multiple comeback wins with huge fourth quarter throws, playoff appearance, etc, all in his first year where he doesn't know anything and hasn't seen anything. Why so down on him?


I have no beef with him. I have no beef with Love beyond being a Packer. I simply don't believe they're as good as the hype. The Texans were winning games because of their defense, not Stroud. If C-Will has only 23 passing touchdowns next year, I'll be disappointed.

Prepare to be disappointed. C-Will won’t touch these numbers as a rookie, even if he is good.

Stroud finished his rookie season completing 63.9% of his passes for 4,108 yards with 23 touchdowns to five interceptions for a 100.8 passer rating, leading the NFL in pass yards per game (274) and having the lowest interception rate (1.0%).



I feel like this post is another candidate for ZippyTakesGoneBad. The list is long and distinguished.
Author:  Hussra [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Every receiver for the Texans increased their production with Stroud, including the washed TE they brought in from Dallas.

e.g., Nico Collins:

2021 446 yds
2022 481 yds
2023 1297 yds
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
veganfan21 wrote:
Not sure about that, nas. They averaged 5.7 more points per game than they did last year. Why? That's all Stroud. That per game increase has them ranked 14 overall in offense dvoa. On defense they ranked 17, just behind the bears. Stroud was the primary driver of their turnaround.


Why would that be all Stroud? They had a lot of low scoring games. The defense wasn't giving up a lot of points.
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
What's your beef with Stroud, nas. MVP consideration, multiple comeback wins with huge fourth quarter throws, playoff appearance, etc, all in his first year where he doesn't know anything and hasn't seen anything. Why so down on him?


I have no beef with him. I have no beef with Love beyond being a Packer. I simply don't believe they're as good as the hype. The Texans were winning games because of their defense, not Stroud. If C-Will has only 23 passing touchdowns next year, I'll be disappointed.

Prepare to be disappointed. C-Will won’t touch these numbers as a rookie, even if he is good.

Stroud finished his rookie season completing 63.9% of his passes for 4,108 yards with 23 touchdowns to five interceptions for a 100.8 passer rating, leading the NFL in pass yards per game (274) and having the lowest interception rate (1.0%).


You would be picking in the top 5 if Love had only 23 passing touchdowns. I don't expect C-Will to have fewer turnovers, but I expect better or comparable in every other category. You can quote me on this.
Author:  veganfan21 [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 3:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Not sure about that, nas. They averaged 5.7 more points per game than they did last year. Why? That's all Stroud. That per game increase has them ranked 14 overall in offense dvoa. On defense they ranked 17, just behind the bears. Stroud was the primary driver of their turnaround.


Why would that be all Stroud? They had a lot of low scoring games. The defense wasn't giving up a lot of points.


It's clearly Stroud for many reasons, including the stats Zippy cited. I'm not bashing the Houston defense but they were per the numbers an average to slightly above average D for the whole season, comparable to the bears. They surrendered 19.7 per game on defense, good enough for 12th overall. They scored 22.7 per game, more than the Chiefs. Last year, without Stroud, they scored 17 per game.
Author:  Nas [ Mon Feb 12, 2024 4:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Herbert > Purdy?
veganfan21 wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Not sure about that, nas. They averaged 5.7 more points per game than they did last year. Why? That's all Stroud. That per game increase has them ranked 14 overall in offense dvoa. On defense they ranked 17, just behind the bears. Stroud was the primary driver of their turnaround.


Why would that be all Stroud? They had a lot of low scoring games. The defense wasn't giving up a lot of points.


It's clearly Stroud for many reasons, including the stats Zippy cited. I'm not bashing the Houston defense but they were per the numbers an average to slightly above average D for the whole season, comparable to the bears. They surrendered 19.7 per game on defense, good enough for 12th overall. They scored 22.7 per game, more than the Chiefs. Last year, without Stroud, they scored 17 per game.


Houston's defense gave up fewer than 20 points 9 times during the regular season. The Texans scored more than 23 points in 4 games and there were special teams and defensive touchdowns included in there. Justin Fields had the same total touchdowns a year before and averaged virtually the same number this year. I love the efficiency, but I would take Love's overall production over Stroud's every year.

Edit: Mitch (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky had more touchdowns in fewer games, with a great defense, in 2018 and we wanted to run him out of town. Now it makes you a top 5 player. GTFOH!
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