Urlacher is whoever the draft at #1.

The Bears will have always "passed" on Stroud for whoever they pick at #1. My argument is that as long as #1 ends up a good pick then it doesn't make it a bad trade that they passed on someone even if they end up the better player.

Of course, the Urlacher-Brady one is extreme given it's unlikely that either Stroud or Williams end up in the HOF but it's also yet another amazing point.

They passed on Stroud for Wright and Stevenson and Moore. They had no idea where they’d be picking this year so it’s silly to suggest they passed on Stroud for the first overall pick a year later.

They also had no idea how good Stroud would be at the time so wouldn't it also be meaningless that Stroud was good if it is meaningless that they ended up with the #1 overall pick?

A guy paid to pick football players can’t fall back on the “I had no idea that the 2nd overall pick was good” argument.

We can do that, but an NFL GM probably shouldn’t.

They passed on Stroud for Wright and Stevenson and Moore. They had no idea where they’d be picking this year so it’s silly to suggest they passed on Stroud for the first overall pick a year later.

He also can say "He thought the value of the first round pick the year after was better".

We know Stroud is good. We know he got the #1 pick. If one is a valid way to judge his decision then so is the other.

You can't exclude the additional picks. There had to be a calculation of how great the Panthers would be this year.

A guy paid to pick football players can’t fall back on the “I had no idea that the 2nd overall pick was good” argument.

We can do that, but an NFL GM probably shouldn’t.

I agree with Antioch - looking back years from now with hindsight, the debate is Stroud vs Wright, Moore, etc. If the QB from this draft doesn't hit and Stroud continues his ascent to stardom then - again in hindsight - we didn't win the trade. A good to great QB is more valuable than all the pieces the Bears got in the trade. Again, the Jets are a really talented team, perhaps more talented than the chefs. But their QB sucks so all that talent is wasted. When Minny lost cousins this year they went from playoff team to out of the race, it didn't matter that they had Jefferson, Addison, and Hockenson. When Burrow went down Cincy lost all hope. And so on.

I am including it and I agree with you - if the draft pick hits (we get a star QB) then in hindsight it was a good trade, but if the pick doesn't and Stroud continues to ball out, then in hindsight we lose. I say we lose because in hindsight/if you knew the future you'd go back and take the star QB who was a star for 10+ years over the star LT, star WR, picks, etc.

I am including it and I agree with you - if the draft pick hits (we get a star QB) then in hindsight it was a good trade, but if the pick doesn't and Stroud continues to ball out, then in hindsight we lose. I say we lose because in hindsight/if you knew the future you'd go back and take the star QB who was a star for 10+ years over the star LT, star WR, picks, etc.

But again, by the same logic, Brian Urlacher was a bad draft pick because we passed on Tom Brady.

It was a great trade. If the Bears could go back right now and undo it they wouldn't. Carolina would.

It’s hard to include the full vale of Williams in “The Haul” because it was luck that Carolina was the worst team.

Bryce Young will be better this season.

He's not The One. He has Stage 4 Midgetcondria.

I hear you. I don't believe he sucked because he was short. He literally had no time or weapons. I think they'll give him something to work with. His coach looks good.

Tom Brady wasn’t a reasonable alternative to the Urlacher pick. Stroud was going to be drafted at or around the pick the Bears traded.

The trade looks great today. If Stroud has a great career & is the long term answer for the Texans, while the Bears never figure out the QB position and top out at a 9-10 win team on the back of a solid run blocking RT & a few years of DJ Moore, it won’t have been a great trade. It would arguably be worse than the T.rubisky over Mahomes pick.

Agreed with Antioch. I know what you're saying, Rick, but I'm basing this on the bears situation and options at the time. I also disagree with you saying Carolina would undo the trade. They would still take the trade except instead of picking Young they'd take Stroud. Yes, Stroud wouldn't have Moore to throw to, but finding WRs is much easier than finding your QB.

Agreed with Antioch. I know what you're saying, Rick, but I'm basing this on the bears situation and options at the time. I also disagree with you saying Carolina would undo the trade. They would still take the trade except instead of picking Young they'd take Stroud. Yes, Stroud wouldn't have Moore to throw to, but finding WRs is much easier than finding your QB.

I'm not sure we understand one another. Let me try a different way:

What's the bigger jackpot between hitting at QB with one pick or hitting at four other important skill positions but not having a QB?

I'm not sure we understand one another. Let me try a different way:

What's the bigger jackpot between hitting at QB with one pick or hitting at four other important skill positions but not having a QB?