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The difference between Jordan and "the others" http://chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=91&t=106969	Page 7 of 11

Author:	Joe Orr Road Rod [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
Nas wrote: Really? Kareem was NEVER the best player on the Lakers with Magic? WOW! You can obviously make a case for Magic's rookie year. I think Kareem was MVP. But then there's Game 6 where the best point guard in NBA history started at center when Kareem was hurt and, well, we know what happened.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
Nas wrote: leashyourkids wrote: What old man JORR forgets is that the Bulls had the best record in NBA history AND won the title. They were historically good. As such, it is absolutely possible to simultaneously think Jordan is GOAT and that Scottie Pippen was one of the greatest of all-time too. JORR, you act like those statements are mutually exclusive, but they're not. They're arguably the best duo ever. What I will agree with you on is the perceived infallibility of Jordan by some. There was not a more loyal MJ fan on this planet during his run than I was. I was young, but I think that only added to the mystique. I loved him, and I watched every minute of every game he played during the second threepeat... That said, there is a decent argument to be made that Lebron is as good as Jordan. I don't personally agree with it, and I think making the argument that he's better would be really tough, but it's not absurd. What Lebron has done is nothing short of amazing. The expectations for this guy were off the chart as a teenager, and he has single-handedly kept the East from becoming a laughing stock. If Lebron James didn't headline these past few teams in the East, the NBA would be embarrassingly lopsided. Basically, any team he is on is coming out of the East. And there's no way you can convince me that exchanging a 32-year-old Lebron for a 32-year-old Jordan (he was 32 in '96 and Lebron has more miles) would have affected the outcome. I believe Jordan to be the GOAT, but it's nonsense to act like there's no argument. All-in-all, JORR is primarily wrong, as usual, but he is partially correct on that one facet of the argument. If you believe that it isn't absurd then make the argument. I easily can, but you'd have to drop your ridiculously orthodoxed and simple belief that rings are all that matters.

Author:	Nas [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
They won the championship because of Kareem but Magic had a great game. Kareem actually played better the following year too. Magic came up small enough to get his infamous nickname.

Author:	Nas [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: Nas wrote: leashyourkids wrote: What old man JORR forgets is that the Bulls had the best record in NBA history AND won the title. They were historically good. As such, it is absolutely possible to simultaneously think Jordan is GOAT and that Scottie Pippen was one of the greatest of all-time too. JORR, you act like those statements are mutually exclusive, but they're not. They're arguably the best duo ever. What I will agree with you on is the perceived infallibility of Jordan by some. There was not a more loyal MJ fan on this planet during his run than I was. I was young, but I think that only added to the mystique. I loved him, and I watched every minute of every game he played during the second threepeat... That said, there is a decent argument to be made that Lebron is as good as Jordan. I don't personally agree with it, and I think making the argument that he's better would be really tough, but it's not absurd. What Lebron has done is nothing short of amazing. The expectations for this guy were off the chart as a teenager, and he has single-handedly kept the East from becoming a laughing stock. If Lebron James didn't headline these past few teams in the East, the NBA would be embarrassingly lopsided. Basically, any team he is on is coming out of the East. And there's no way you can convince me that exchanging a 32-year-old Lebron for a 32-year-old Jordan (he was 32 in '96 and Lebron has more miles) would have affected the outcome. I believe Jordan to be the GOAT, but it's nonsense to act like there's no argument. All-in-all, JORR is primarily wrong, as usual, but he is partially correct on that one facet of the argument. If you believe that it isn't absurd then make the argument. I easily can, but you'd have to drop your ridiculously orthodoxed and simple belief that rings are all that matters. What I think shouldn't prevent you from making the case.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
Nas wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears. FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. I know I'm missing many players here: Jordan Magic Bird Kareem Wilt Russell Hakeem Shaq Thomas Erving Shaq LBJ Durant Wade Dirk Kobe Hill Mcgrady Chris Paul Westbrook KG Barkley Malone Robertson David Robinson Duncan Kawhi Leonard Anthony Davis Elgin Baylor West Moses Malone McHale Cousy Havilek Petit Mikan McHale Kidd

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
veganfan21 wrote: Nas wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears. FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. I know I'm missing many players here: Jordan Magic Bird Kareem Wilt Russell Hakeem Shaq Thomas Erving Shaq LBJ Durant Wade Dirk Kobe Hill Mcgrady Chris Paul Westbrook KG Barkley Malone Robertson David Robinson Duncan Kawhi Leonard Anthony Davis Elgin Baylor West Moses Malone McHale Cousy Havilek Petit Mikan McHale Kidd Half that list is so wrong, you shouldn't be able to post in the NBA section again.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument. I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive.

Author:	Brick [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: veganfan21 wrote: Nas wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears. FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. I know I'm missing many players here: Jordan Magic Bird Kareem Wilt Russell Hakeem Shaq Thomas Erving Shaq LBJ Durant Wade Dirk Kobe Hill Mcgrady Chris Paul Westbrook KG Barkley Malone Robertson David Robinson Duncan Kawhi Leonard Anthony Davis Elgin Baylor West Moses Malone McHale Cousy Havilek Petit Mikan McHale Kidd Half that list is so wrong, you shouldn't be able to post in the NBA section again. Yup. Nas please ban.

Author:	veganfan21 [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: veganfan21 wrote: Nas wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears. FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. I know I'm missing many players here: Jordan Magic Bird Kareem Wilt Russell Hakeem Shaq Thomas Erving Shaq LBJ Durant Wade Dirk Kobe Hill Mcgrady Chris Paul Westbrook KG Barkley Malone Robertson David Robinson Duncan Kawhi Leonard Anthony Davis Elgin Baylor West Moses Malone McHale Cousy Havilek Petit Mikan McHale Kidd Half that list is so wrong, you shouldn't be able to post in the NBA section again. The way I look at it is if you've got the no 1 pick and your choice is a 25 year old Pippen vs anyone on that list at 25, who are you taking?

Author:	Nas [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
veganfan21 wrote: Nas wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears. FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him. I know I'm missing many players here: Jordan Magic Bird Kareem Wilt Russell Hakeem Shaq Thomas Erving Shaq LBJ Durant Wade Dirk Kobe Hill Mcgrady Chris Paul Westbrook KG Barkley Malone Robertson David Robinson Duncan Kawhi Leonard Anthony Davis Elgin Baylor West Moses Malone McHale Cousy Havilek Petit Mikan McHale Kidd What were you thinking?

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:19 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
veganfan21 wrote: leashyourkids wrote: I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument. I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive. Jordan was far superior defensively and for a longer period of time. Like Rick and I mentioned earlier, if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is why we have much better metrics for evaluating performance, and Jordan's stats stand up to anyone's when we get into many advanced metrics.

Author:	Nas [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument. Yes LeBron may be the most physically gifted player ever.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is retarded. You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats. I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: leashyourkids wrote: I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument. I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive. Jordan was far superior defensively and for a longer period of time. Like Rick and I mentioned earlier, if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is why we have much better metrics for evaluating performance, and Jordan's stats stand up to anyone's when we get into many advanced metrics. You always like to say people should watch more basketball before commenting, so let me ask you this: did you ever watch Jordan in real time?

Author:	veganfan21 [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:32 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: leashyourkids wrote: I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument. I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive. Jordan was far superior defensively and for a longer period of time. Like Rick and I mentioned earlier, if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is why we have much better metrics for evaluating performance, and Jordan's stats stand up to anyone's when we get into many advanced metrics. I don't think I articulated my point well. I'll put it in similar terms to what Nas said above: I think if you're imagining the perfect player, you're imagining LBJ's physical makeup and tools with Jordan's competitiveness and drive. Rebounds and assists are not empty numbers, but I'm not saying that alone makes James the superior talent.

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: FavreFan wrote: if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is retarded. You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats. I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately. What's retarded is your constant dismissal of stats that are better at quantifying what happens on a court than traditional numbers. I never use advanced metrics as a sole determiner of who a better player is, but ignoring additional data is just dumb. I don't know why you continue to do it with basketball. Anyway, like I was saying, LeBron isn't the overall superior talent between the two. And if you think a couple more rebounds and a couple more assists per game are evidence he is, I would advise looking into further stats and data. That is all.

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
veganfan21 wrote: FavreFan wrote: veganfan21 wrote: leashyourkids wrote: I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it.. James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had. I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument. I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive. Jordan was far superior defensively and for a longer period of time. Like Rick and I mentioned earlier, if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is why we have much better metrics for evaluating performance, and Jordan's stats stand up to anyone's when we get into many advanced metrics. I don't think I articulated my point well. I'll put it in similar terms to what Nas said above: I think if you're imagining the perfect player, you're imagining LBJ's physical makeup and tools with Jordan's competitiveness and drive. Rebounds and assists are not empty numbers, but I'm not saying that alone makes James the superior talent. But if I'm imagining the perfect player I'm imagining the best scorer and the best defender in the league combined into one. Jordan is much closer to reaching that ideal than LeBron. If we are using rebounds and assists to point to LeBron's more well rounded game, I would counter with PER, W/48, spg, bpg, PPG,All defensive first teams, etc

Author:	veganfan21 [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:38 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: leashyourkids wrote: FavreFan wrote: if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is retarded. You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats. I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately. What's retarded is your constant dismissal of stats that are better at quantifying what happens on a court than traditional numbers. I never use advanced metrics as a sole determiner of who a better player is, but ignoring additional data is just dumb. I don't know why you continue to do it with basketball. Anyway, like I was saying, LeBron isn't the overall superior talent between the two. And if you think a couple more rebounds and a couple more assists per game are evidence he is, I would advise looking into further stats and data. That is all. Again it's not just boards and assists, but his numbers there just demonstrate what lyk and others already pointed out: he gets those numbers simply because he can do more than Jordan, like guard all five positions. And that's no knock on Jordan - it's just a function of LBJ's height and body.

Author:	Brick [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
veganfan21 wrote: FavreFan wrote: leashyourkids wrote: FavreFan wrote: if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is retarded. You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats. I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately. What's retarded is your constant dismissal of stats that are better at quantifying what happens on a court than traditional numbers. I never use advanced metrics as a sole determiner of who a better player is, but ignoring additional data is just dumb. I don't know why you continue to do it with basketball. Anyway, like I was saying, LeBron isn't the overall superior talent between the two. And if you think a couple more rebounds and a couple more assists per game are evidence he is, I would advise looking into further stats and data. That is all. Again it's not just boards and assists, but his numbers there just demonstrate what lyk and others already pointed out: he gets those numbers simply because he can do more than Jordan, like guard all five positions. And that's no knock on Jordan - it's just a function of LBJ's height and body. LeBron couldn't guard 5 positions in the 90s.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:44 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: leashyourkids wrote: FavreFan wrote: if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is retarded. You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats. I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately. What's retarded is your constant dismissal of stats that are better at quantifying what happens on a court than traditional numbers. I never use advanced metrics as a sole determiner of who a better player is, but ignoring additional data is just dumb. I don't know why you continue to do it with basketball. Anyway, like I was saying, LeBron isn't the overall superior talent between the two. And if you think a couple more rebounds and a couple more assists per game are evidence he is, I would advise looking into further stats and data. That is all. Who do you think dreams up those stats? Do you think their thought processes are informed by what players they've watched play (and like)? A stat like PER, for example, is asinine. It's just a big glob of numbers that are weighted by nerds at ESPN. I have very little use for advanced stats in basketball, and I always will. The game has too many variables that are out of player control.

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
Ok, I think that's silly but I understand it. The good thing with jordan is there are a bunch of different angles you can argue his GOAT case from. With LeBron you're fairly limited.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: Ok, I think that's silly but I understand it. The good thing with jordan is there are a bunch of different angles you can argue his GOAT case from. With LeBron you're fairly limited. I THINK JORDAN IS GOAT FOR CHRIST SAKE.

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: FavreFan wrote: Ok, I think that's silly but I understand it. The good thing with jordan is there are a bunch of different angles you can argue his GOAT case from. With LeBron you're fairly limited. I THINK JORDAN IS GOAT FOR CHRIST SAKE. I know. I never said you didn't. I think you missed my entire point here, which is that LeBron was not a more talented, or whatever phrase you want to go with, player than jordan. I think it's wrong to state he was like it's an objective fact.

Author:	Brick [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
I'm taller than most of this board. I guess I'm more talented!

Author:	Don Tiny [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:55 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: Nas wrote: leashyourkids wrote: What old man JORR forgets is that the Bulls had the best record in NBA history AND won the title. They were historically good. As such, it is absolutely possible to simultaneously think Jordan is GOAT and that Scottie Pippen was one of the greatest of all-time too. JORR, you act like those statements are mutually exclusive, but they're not. They're arguably the best duo ever. What I will agree with you on is the perceived infallibility of Jordan by some. There was not a more loyal MJ fan on this planet during his run than I was. I was young, but I think that only added to the mystique. I loved him, and I watched every minute of every game he played during the second threepeat... That said, there is a decent argument to be made that Lebron is as good as Jordan. I don't personally agree with it, and I think making the argument that he's better would be really tough, but it's not absurd. What Lebron has done is nothing short of amazing. The expectations for this guy were off the chart as a teenager, and he has single-handedly kept the East from becoming a laughing stock. If Lebron James didn't headline these past few teams in the East, the NBA would be embarrassingly lopsided. Basically, any team he is on is coming out of the East. And there's no way you can convince me that exchanging a 32-year-old Lebron for a 32-year-old Jordan (he was 32 in '96 and Lebron has more miles) would have affected the outcome. I believe Jordan to be the GOAT, but it's nonsense to act like there's no argument. All-in-all, JORR is primarily wrong, as usual, but he is partially correct on that one facet of the argument. If you believe that it isn't absurd then make the argument. I easily can, but you'd have to drop your ridiculously orthodoxed and simple belief that rings are all that matters. JORR + Robert Horry = MATCH Also ... vegan ... Bob fucking Cousy is better than Pip? That's just awful. Pip would feed him so many nut sammiches that Bob would go into anaphylactic shock.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
Boilermaker Rick wrote: I'm taller than most of this board. I guess I'm more talented! Don't be an idiot.

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
Don Tiny wrote: leashyourkids wrote: Nas wrote: leashyourkids wrote: What old man JORR forgets is that the Bulls had the best record in NBA history AND won the title. They were historically good. As such, it is absolutely possible to simultaneously think Jordan is GOAT and that Scottie Pippen was one of the greatest of all-time too. JORR, you act like those statements are mutually exclusive, but they're not. They're arguably the best duo ever. What I will agree with you on is the perceived infallibility of Jordan by some. There was not a more loyal MJ fan on this planet during his run than I was. I was young, but I think that only added to the mystique. I loved him, and I watched every minute of every game he played during the second threepeat... That said, there is a decent argument to be made that Lebron is as good as Jordan. I don't personally agree with it, and I think making the argument that he's better would be really tough, but it's not absurd. What Lebron has done is nothing short of amazing. The expectations for this guy were off the chart as a teenager, and he has single-handedly kept the East from becoming a laughing stock. If Lebron James didn't headline these past few teams in the East, the NBA would be embarrassingly lopsided. Basically, any team he is on is coming out of the East. And there's no way you can convince me that exchanging a 32-year-old Lebron for a 32-year-old Jordan (he was 32 in '96 and Lebron has more miles) would have affected the outcome. I believe Jordan to be the GOAT, but it's nonsense to act like there's no argument. All-in-all, JORR is primarily wrong, as usual, but he is partially correct on that one facet of the argument. If you believe that it isn't absurd then make the argument. I easily can, but you'd have to drop your ridiculously orthodoxed and simple belief that rings are all that matters. JORR + Robert Horry = MATCH Also ... vegan ... Bob fucking Cousy is better than Pip? I ... even I don't have a rejoinder for that ... that's just awful. You're not impressed by a career 37% shooter who could only dribble one direction?

Author:	FavreFan [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
leashyourkids wrote: Boilermaker Rick wrote: I'm taller than most of this board. I guess I'm more talented! Don't be an idiot. It's interesting you get so angry when anyone dares challenge your over the top LeBron love.

Author:	leashyourkids [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:59 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: The difference between Jordan and "the others"
FavreFan wrote: leashyourkids wrote: Boilermaker Rick wrote: I'm taller than most of this board. I guess I'm more talented! Don't be an idiot. It's interesting you get so angry when anyone dares challenge your over the top LeBron love. Right.

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