What old man JORR forgets is that the Bulls had the best record in NBA history AND won the title. They were historically good. As such, it is absolutely possible to simultaneously think Jordan is GOAT and that Scottie Pippen was one of the greatest of all-time too. JORR, you act like those statements are mutually exclusive, but they're not. They're arguably the best duo ever.

What I will agree with you on is the perceived infallibility of Jordan by some. There was not a more loyal MJ fan on this planet during his run than I was. I was young, but I think that only added to the mystique. I loved him, and I watched every minute of every game he played during the second threepeat...

That said, there is a decent argument to be made that Lebron is as good as Jordan. I don't personally agree with it, and I think making the argument that he's better would be really tough, but it's not absurd. What Lebron has done is nothing short of amazing. The expectations for this guy were off the chart as a teenager, and he has single-handedly kept the East from becoming a laughing stock. If Lebron James didn't headline these past few teams in the East, the NBA would be embarrassingly lopsided. Basically, any team he is on is coming out of the East. And there's no way you can convince me that exchanging a 32-year-old Lebron for a 32-year-old Jordan (he was 32 in '96 and Lebron has more miles) would have affected the outcome. I believe Jordan to be the GOAT, but it's nonsense to act like there's no argument.

All-in-all, JORR is primarily wrong, as usual, but he is partially correct on that one facet of the argument.

If you believe that it isn't absurd then make the argument.

There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him.

There are 50 players better than Pippen. There might be 80 players better than him.

Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears.

I know I'm missing many players here:

Jordan
Magic
Bird
Kareem
Wilt
Russell
Hakeem
Shaq
Thomas
Erving
Shaq
LBJ
Durant
Wade
Dirk
Kobe
Hill
Mcgrady
Chris Paul
Westbrook
KG
Barkley
Malone
Robertson
David Robinson
Duncan
Kawhi Leonard
Anthony Davis
Elgin Baylor
West
Moses Malone
McHale
Cousy
Havilek
Petit
Mikan
McHale
Kidd

I know I'm missing many players here:

Jordan
Magic
Bird
Kareem
Wilt
Russell
Hakeem
Shaq
Thomas
Erving
Shaq
LBJ
Durant
Wade
Dirk
Kobe
Hill
Mcgrady
Chris Paul
Westbrook
KG
Barkley
Malone
Robertson
David Robinson
Duncan
Kawhi Leonard
Anthony Davis
Elgin Baylor
West
Moses Malone
McHale
Cousy
Havilek
Petit
Mikan
McHale
Kidd

Your breath still smells like Similac. All wet behind the ears.

I'll make the argument even though I don't agree with it..

James is physically more talented than Jordan. He has the body of Malone with better offensive skills than Magic. He has range that Jordan didnt have. He is a better distributor and rebounder. He has been to 8 consecutive finals, and he's done it with multiple teams. He came back from 3-1 to beat a team that was heralded at one time as the best ever. In his prime, he could lock down any player in the league and could legitimately guard all five positions. He is currently 32, which was MJ's age in '96 after he lost a lot of athleticism. Lebron has lost some but not to the extent that Jordan had.

I could make the case for MJ in a separate post, but this isn't an absurd argument.

I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive.

I agree and I don't think it's so controversial. LBJ is the superior overall talent (MJ was a better scorer), but Jordan was more competitive.

if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan.

Jordan was far superior defensively and for a longer period of time. Like Rick and I mentioned earlier, if you put so much stock into rebounds and assists that it leads you to say LeBron is superior to Jordan than you also have to acknowledge that Harden and Westbrook are also better than jordan. This is why we have much better metrics for evaluating performance, and Jordan's stats stand up to anyone's when we get into many advanced metrics.

This is retarded.

You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats.

I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately.

What's retarded is your constant dismissal of stats that are better at quantifying what happens on a court than traditional numbers. I never use advanced metrics as a sole determiner of who a better player is, but ignoring additional data is just dumb. I don't know why you continue to do it with basketball.

Anyway, like I was saying, LeBron isn't the overall superior talent between the two. And if you think a couple more rebounds and a couple more assists per game are evidence he is, I would advise looking into further stats and data. That is all.

This is retarded.

You need to get away from your NBA "advanced stats." Basketball isn't baseball. It's impossible to describe with stats.

I listened to Hollinger say Rose was an average guard the whole year in 2011 when he won MVP. His rationale was that people like Paul were more "efficient." The problem with that theory is that if you wanted the ball in the hands of a guy who would win you the game on a last-second possession that year, it was Derrick Rose. There was no stat for that, unfortunately.

Ok, I think that's silly but I understand it. The good thing with jordan is there are a bunch of different angles you can argue his GOAT case from. With LeBron you're fairly limited.

If you believe that it isn't absurd then make the argument.

I easily can, but you'd have to drop your ridiculously orthodoxed and simple belief that rings are all that matters.

I'm taller than most of this board. I guess I'm more talented!

Don't be an idiot.