Shakes is completely right

I am very ignorant to this guy other than things I’ve read and highlights...

But I’m assuming he’s not expected to ever be a scorer, right? In my limited observations, he’s tall but not overly quick, right? Good vision and decision-making but not real explosive?

And his shot is bizarre, which doesn’t matter in and of itself, but it also seems to be a slow release that has to have ample room to get off.

I’m not saying that my observations are necessarily right, but that’s just what I’ve seen in admittedly limited viewing.

He really does remind me of a young Shaun Livingston before the injuries. I have a hard time seeing where he’ll ever be a big scorer.

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People hope for 15 ppg I think

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Similar height wise but Sean Livingston was more talented. didn't have the range Ball has but he was a more complete player. Didn't have the holes in his game Ball has. Better athlete better handle and better defender. Livingston was fluid. I think I remember you saying you played against him in high school so you know what I'm talking about. if I'm wrong about that you can correct me. Livingston was going to be an All star. The projections for Ball aren't quite the same from what I've seen.

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You could say that. I played him in a Gus Macker 3 on 3 and he stood at the top of the key and just passed to his talented teammates for a complete shellacking of our team.

He wasn’t really trying in that, but I saw him play plenty in high school. I don’t know how he’d be viewed today. Super talented, no doubt, but his lack of range wouldn’t have been great in today’s pick and roll obsessed game. But yeah - based on what I’ve seen, he was probably more athletic and he was a hell of a post passer... probably more athletic than Ball but was really never a great shooter.

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He had mid range shot but definitely had no range. I wonder how he would have fit in today's 3 point obsessed league too. Sure his shot would have improved but I never could seem him as a deep threat. I think Simmons is dispelling the notion that you need that to succeed. That is why I'm loving his game so much.

He had the best handle of any 6'7 6'8 guy that I have ever seen. it was fluid. Livingston

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Got switched back and forth on picks between Gasol and Conley tonight and defended both well. Iso'd on Gasol a couple times he didn't let him score. It's not a question anymore of if he's good defensively. It's how good can he be.

Still bad offensively so far though.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Lonzo Ball blows. When you factor in what he was hyped to be and what he has shown himself to be he stinks. Mario Chalmers of all people with a blow by. Another airball/bad shooting night and a crucial turnover in crunch time.

The bad teammates of his are playing much better than he is at this point. If he displays All Star ability at some point then I will change my opinion and admit I'm wrong but as it stands now he sort of stinks. Walton has been shortening his minutes lately. Don't know what they were today but previous 3 it's been at about 28 per game. He obviously isn't happy and you could hear the groans from some of the Laker fans after some of those shots he took tonight.

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He doesn't suck. Overall he's a net positive. This is demonstrated by his +/-, his defensive metrics, and the fact that if you watch the games his team plays better on both ends with him than without him.

He's a mixed bag so far. Not sure what he will be. He's pretty bad on offense, pretty good on defense.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I just provided about 4-5 things which happened during the last 5 minutes of the game. It's obvious I've been watching. Interesting how his negative plus minus was never an issue for you but now his positive one is. He is about the 5th or 6th best player on this team. You can't casually dismiss his terrible offense either. It's a crucial part of the game in case you didn't notice.

Where did I learn he'd be bad at offense? Summer League basketball. That's where. Saw it coming a mile away. All those damn airballs and bricks he shot told me a lot more than the gaudy percentages he posted playing in meaningless college basketball games.

Where did I learn about Kuzma? Summer League basketball. That's where.

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Yet shakes is the only one that mentioned Kuzma in the summer league thread here...

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

I actually mentioned it in the Summer league thread that's why. You know summer league basketball. That brand of hoops in which nothing is to be gained. At least that's what MANY tried to tell me.

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Lonzo has been OK. Somewhere between Shakes and LTG evaluations . I haven't seen much that says star, but at same time not much that says complete bust.

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At least 5 rookies look better, he will make a living in the league but he will never be a star.

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If the NBA was the dope game someone would've already whacked Lavar for trying to pass baking soda off as coke. He'd have been beaten for passing huff weed off as diesel.

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I don't know if that is true or not, but my fantasy draft chat discussed him often, and he was highly touted before a single regular season game. He did very well in summer league.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

According to our handy search function the only person to mention him in the summer thread was shakes.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

I also find that basketball is discussed outside of one thread on one message board. I hate to break it to you, but Kyle Kuzma was thought highly of by many NBA fans besides shakes, including myself. I don't think others that viewed him highly would be disqualified if they hadn't posted about him in a single thread you singled out (which you were wrong about anyway, since that LTG post came from that thread.)

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I never said he wasnt. Stop stretching what I said. I just found it odd that shakes said nothing about him in a thread dedicated to summer league after saying he learned about him during summer ball.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

You mean LTG, and he did. On October 3rd, which is where that quote came from.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Who do you think you're kidding? You never heard of Kuzma till probably 2 weeks before the season.

I've noticed that ALL of your NBA thoughts are just parroted from other people or websites. For instance, a couple weeks ago when you were talking about the draft and you said you would rather have Kuzma and some other player drafted late who is doing well over someone who was drafted higher but is struggling. Basically you just picked out the 2 guys who were the biggest surprises and tried to pass it off as if you figured that out on your own. And of course, who can forget your Lonzo vs MCW comparison that you brought to the board. No mention of the fact that several people on RealGM and other websites had already brought up that comparison weeks prior.


I can't think of a single original thought you've posted about the NBA all season.

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Another really solid game for Lonzo. Still shooting poorly like so many other rookies, but getting into the lane at will and starting to look a little better on his at the rim finishes. As he gets confident and comfortable that is only going to improve. Did a great job dictating the pace that led to the Lakers blowing it open. 2 turnovers, a high number for him these days. 7 assists despite playing for the worst 3 pt shooting team in the league.


Still find the team very confusing the watch. They're supposed to be pushing the ball, yet when the ball is inbounded after a score you'll see Lonzo and 1-2 other Lakers standing in the backcourt waiting for the inbounds pass. KCP thinks he is the PG, Ingram thinks he is the PG, CLarkson thinks he is the pG, heck even Randle thinks he is a PG. Walton needs to tell these idiots to run down the floor after the ball is scored so Lonzo actually has some targets to pass to or at least it will open up the midcourt to allow Lonzo to put some pressure on the D.

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Well you're wrong. And I have no idea what RealGM is.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Additionally, I've had double the posts in the NBA section over the last three years than you have. I have thousands of posts in the section between IMU, immessedup17 and the 15,000 posts bigfan deleted.

You're new to this. Your weird obsession with Lonzo Ball doesn't make you an NBA guy.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

What does that have to do with anything? Try having an original thought that you didn't parrot from someone else. Comparing Lonzo to MCW isn't an original thought when 100s of people online were making that exact same comparison weeks before you even brought it up. Jumping into the rookie thread a week into the season to say you wanted the Bulls to draft Dennis Smith, Kuzma or John Collins rather than The Finnish Splash when those guys just happened to be the 3 guys drafted after Lauri who played great in SL, preseason and the first week of the season and trying to pass that off as something you felt back in June is a clown move.

And for the record, I've been a NBA fan longer than you've been alive. I just took a little hiatus.

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Lonzo with 23 assists and 2 turnovers in his last 4 games. Not exactly the stuff of rookies.

Also dominating the +/- stat that morons here love to cite, but for some reason aren't citing anymore. Or maybe the one moron is, but I wouldn't know cause he now lives in FOE land.

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I do not know this to be true, and I don't care if it is. I'm not the only intelligent basketball fan. It isn't surprising that hundreds of others can see what I see. It validates my opinion - it does not invalidate it.



So you don't know the lay of the land.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Too busy reading the meanderings of an asshole to pay attention to a seemingly meaningless stat I guess. Playing "great" despite possessing the worst field goal percentage in the league. Now we are down to touting assist to turnovers ratio. That is til that begins to falter then it will be the rebounds, defense, etc. When it comes down to it the kid is a damn flop as it is presently constituted. His minutes have decreased by about 6-7 per game and it is obvious that he is 5th best on a garbage ass team. Guy backing him up looks more impressive than him every game.

Argument also sounds dumb when you consider the fact that the jerk is now advocating for better teammates. Guys that are "studs" don't need better teammates to be "studs". They need better teammates to win games.

For the record Brook Lopez is a top 5-6 center when healthy. He is far from a bum.

Anyone with a functioning brain would know that the +/- numbers are a product of what his teammates are doing and not him.

He is 6 for 30 over his last 3 games yet he somehow is looking "great". Credibility on this was shot to hell once he went scoreless with 3 and 4 of whatever and yet the clown still came on here talking about how great he played.

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