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Cheating Astros

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good dolphin

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:04 pm

Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 2:35 pm
Posts: 80566

man of few opinions wrote:

Boilermaker Rick wrote:

2005 now goes down as an all time great performance given the team they beat in the World Series.

The National League version of the Astros played by the rules. The AL version has no scruples.

They were forced to to try and keep up in the superior league

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Regular Reader

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:09 pm

Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 8:10 pm
Posts: 38609
Location: "Across 110th Street"

Walt Williams Neck wrote:

Ridiculous! What's next telling opponent teams that their pitchers are tipping pitches off? For years the Cubs and Red Sox scoreboards were almost a perfect places to steal signs from, Chris Sale with his binocular tirade in Detroit. When I think Cubs , Red Sox and Tigers I think World Series :roll:

I could tell 3/4 these clowns what was coming and they couldn't hit it! Did hitters know what Rivera was going to throw? Could they hit it? Don't be a bunch of whinny bitches in a sport that is hurting in so many ways

Agreed. This prissy sanctimony is embarrassing the sport of corked bats, loaded and doctored baseballs, internet thieves and horrendous umpires. Not to mention the RIGHT :roll:

kind of sign stealing.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

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Chet Coppock's Fur Coat

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:32 pm

Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2015 9:46 pm
Posts: 9993
pizza_Place: Q's Hillside

If Cora implemented a version of this with the Red Sox, he has to be suspended for at least three years.

I am surprised that Manfred didn't exclude the Astros completely from this year's draft and take away all of their international signing cap for the coming year.

Why are the replay cameras on pre pitch? When the pitcher releases the ball, turn on the feed.

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Darkside

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:23 pm

Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:29 am
Posts: 64787
Location: Darkside Estates
pizza_Place: A cat got an online degree.

Don Tiny wrote:

sjboyd0137 wrote:

The Hawk wrote:

Frank Coztansa wrote:

Damn.

Quote:

Houston Astros general manager Jeff Luhnow and manager AJ Hinch have each been suspended for one year as part of Major League Baseball's ruling in the team's sign-stealing controversy, according to Jeff Passan of ESPN.

The organization has also been fined $5 million and will forfeit its first- and second-round picks in 2020 and 2021, according to Ken Rosenthal and Evan Drellich of The Athletic.

Former Astros assistant GM Brandon Taubman has also been placed on baseball's ineligible list.

Boston Red Sox manager Alex Cora will face "harsh" punishment as well for his role as a bench coach on the 2017 team, although New York Mets manager Carlos Beltran will not be disciplined, nor will any player on the Astros.

I think that the punishment is about right. It is severe with more coming, namely to Cora. This will also place an asterisk on their pennant and World Series wins. I never liked Joey Cora. He's always been a punk and he needs to be banned for at least a year and probably more also. :oops:

What did Joey Cora do?

He's got eyes like a lemur ... he could be up to any number of things.

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bigfan wrote:

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Furious Styles

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:29 pm

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 11486
pizza_Place: Dino's

They will clearly stoop to anything - like throwing the World Series.

*2005

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The Hawk

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:00 pm

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 am
Posts: 14554
pizza_Place: Grazianos

Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:

I liked what the owner did by firing both the Gm and Manager. How baseball allowed this shit to happen is awful. When a dickhead like Alex Cora can organize this stuff, someone in the hierarchy of baseball should also be fired. :cry:

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The Hawk

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:04 pm

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 am
Posts: 14554
pizza_Place: Grazianos

Nardi wrote:

The Hawk wrote:

Douchebag wrote:

Nardi wrote:

Not brutal at all. Manfred confirms the stole signs all through the postseason. They're damn lucky they don't vacate their championship

I don't think this is a big deal at all. Players have been stealing signs for the entire history of the game. If you don't want other teams stealing your signs, get more complex signs.

That is NOT the issue. Using technology is the issue and to some extent baseball itself is to blame partially for it failure to provide safeguards to prevent this shit from being able to be used to send information to the players as to what pitch is coming which of course is a HUGE ADVANTAGE to a player. This kind of stuff has been going on in baseball for decades with teams putting people in scoreboards to spy on the catchers sign and relay the sign to the hitters as well as other stuff.

Stealing signs, in the confines of the playing field, with those involved in the game, is fine. No, you can't be up in the stands or scoreboard. No, you can't be in the bullpen with binoculars. This is common sense stuff.

Yes it is. Back in the day, if you knew that someone was stealing the catchers signs, pitchers had a good way to stop this, namely by hitting the hitter automatically. This stuff really doesn't happen a lot in major league baseball much anymore and it is too bad as far as I am concerned. :bom:

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
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The Hawk

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:11 pm

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 am
Posts: 14554
pizza_Place: Grazianos

tommy wrote:

What will happen to Cora and why did Beltran get off the hook?

Edit--Oh wait, Passan said that since he was a player, no punishment. Meh...

No doubt, one of the reasons that Beltran got hired as manager was his success in this sign stealing stuff. What extent he got involved with Cora in all of this hasn't been exposed yet. But it won't affect this guy because he was just a "player" when it happened although he pretty much never played and was more a coach than a player, right?

Cora will be suspended by the league. What the Red Sox choose to do with him additionally is anyone's guess. They have a decision to make and I hope they do fire his skinny ass. :oops:

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

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The Hawk

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:16 pm

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 am
Posts: 14554
pizza_Place: Grazianos

Regular Reader wrote:

Walt Williams Neck wrote:

Agreed. This prissy sanctimony is embarrassing the sport of corked bats, loaded and doctored baseballs, internet thieves and horrendous umpires. Not to mention the RIGHT :roll:

kind of sign stealing.

What a dumb ass post. YOu tell a major league hitter that a fastball is coming and the odds that something good happens within his at bat improves. Major league hitter thrive on the fastball. Knowing that it is coming and not have to worry about a hard slider or change-up is a huge advantage for a hitter. Also, not all major league pitchers throw 95-100 MPH. Most of them throw 91-94. Come-on. Even you aren't that dumb, are you?

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

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The Hawk

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:23 pm

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 am
Posts: 14554
pizza_Place: Grazianos

They should eliminate all technology from the dugout, period. This includes players cell devices. The technology that exists in the world could provide a hitter with video of his last at bats against the pitcher, for example. That should not be allowed. It would be like allowing students to have access to sites that can provide answers to their test questions. It is nuts. :evil:

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

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Curious Hair

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 7:57 pm

Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 6:29 pm
Posts: 54508
Location: Pearl Harbor, Waukesha, and other things that make no sense
pizza_Place: Lou Malnati's

Five in a row, what'd they do, hire Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez to manage the team

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Don Tiny

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:00 pm

Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 11:10 am
Posts: 42094
Location: Rock Ridge (splendid!)
pizza_Place: Charlie Fox's / Paisano's

Curious Hair wrote:

Five in a row, what'd they do, hire Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez to manage the team

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Walt Williams Neck

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:25 pm

Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:43 pm
Posts: 18473
Location: end of lonely street
pizza_Place: Obbies

The Hawk wrote:

Regular Reader wrote:

Walt Williams Neck wrote:

Agreed. This prissy sanctimony is embarrassing the sport of corked bats, loaded and doctored baseballs, internet thieves and horrendous umpires. Not to mention the RIGHT :roll:

kind of sign stealing.

listen up pip squeak are you and other teams that dumb you can't tell they were sending signals by beating on a fucking garbage can :lol:

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I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

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Frank Coztansa

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 9:14 am

100000 CLUB

Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 6:17 pm
Posts: 102344
pizza_Place: Vito & Nick's

The Hawk wrote:

YOu tell a major league hitter that a fastball is coming and the odds that something good happens within his at bat improves. Major league hitter thrive on the fastball. Knowing that it is coming and not have to worry about a hard slider or change-up is a huge advantage for a hitter. Also, not all major league pitchers throw 95-100 MPH. Most of them throw 91-94. Come-on. Even you aren't that dumb, are you?

Pedro Cerrano:
Bats, they are sick. I cannot hit curveball. Straightball I hit it very much. Curveball, bats are afraid. I ask Jobu to come, take fear from bats. I offer him cigar, rum. He will come.

Eddie Harris:
You know you might think about taking Jesus Christ as your savior instead of fooling around with all this mumbo jumbo.

Pedro Cerrano:
Ah, "hey-Zeus", I like him very much, but he no help with curveball.

Eddie Harris:
You trying to say Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?

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The Hawk

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:52 am

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 am
Posts: 14554
pizza_Place: Grazianos

Frank Coztansa wrote:

The Hawk wrote:

Hats For Bats :!:

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An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

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Douchebag

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:55 am

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 3:03 pm
Posts: 43167

The Hawk wrote:

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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:

I am not a legal expert, how many times do I have to say it?

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man of few opinions

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:58 am

Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:42 pm
Posts: 7242
Location: Land of Lincoln
pizza_Place: Tombstone

if they didn't punish this, and they allowed it as "sign-stealing is part of the game" where electronics and technology were allowed freely, you in essence may as well make a new rule where the pitcher has to announce what pitch he is throwing. The pitcher and catcher cannot possibly overcome the advantage of allowing teams to tell batters during the windup what pitch is coming.

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pittmike

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:10 am

Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:29 pm
Posts: 39966
Location: Everywhere
pizza_Place: giordanos

They should just outlaw breaking balls in the name of saving children's arms anyway. So all fastballs.

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Walt Williams Neck

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:31 pm

Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:43 pm
Posts: 18473
Location: end of lonely street
pizza_Place: Obbies

In the Series the Astro's were 2 and 3 hit....did they not steal signs in those games or did they just not execute? Inquiring minds want to know

Last edited by Walt Williams Neck on Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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badrogue17

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:34 pm

Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 4:29 pm
Posts: 38245
pizza_Place: Lou Malnatis

Walt Williams Neck wrote:

In the Series the Astro's were 2 and 3 hit....did they not steal signs in those games or did they just nott execute? Inquiring minds want to know

Just lost 4 home WS games too. Hey remember when batters knew what Mariano Rivera was throwing and knocked him around the ballpark ?

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Walt Williams Neck

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:40 pm

Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:43 pm
Posts: 18473
Location: end of lonely street
pizza_Place: Obbies

badrogue17 wrote:

Walt Williams Neck wrote:

In the Series the Astro's were 2 and 3 hit....did they not steal signs in those games or did they just nott execute? Inquiring minds want to know

Just lost 4 home WS games too. Hey remember when batters knew what Mariano Rivera was throwing and knocked him around the ballpark ?

I believe I had brought that up.....I'll hang up and wait for Hawk to call you dumb

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Regular Reader

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:25 pm

Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 8:10 pm
Posts: 38609
Location: "Across 110th Street"

The Hawk wrote:

Regular Reader wrote:

Walt Williams Neck wrote:

Agreed. This prissy sanctimony is embarrassing the sport of corked bats, loaded and doctored baseballs, internet thieves and horrendous umpires. Not to mention the RIGHT :roll:

kind of sign stealing.

Whine and bitch more about yet another point that went over your head.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

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Nardi

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:30 pm

Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:19 pm
Posts: 29060
pizza_Place: What??

Remember when Darvish was tipping his pitches?

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Regular Reader

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:34 pm

Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 8:10 pm
Posts: 38609
Location: "Across 110th Street"

man of few opinions wrote:

When Gibson hit his walk-off bomb in '88 he noted how the analytics told him what pitch Eck was more than likely to throw him given the sequence leading up to 3 & 2. Hitting coaches have the books on every experienced pitcher and drum them into the batters' heads. They're loudly complaining about what can't be more than a possibly marginal at best benefit imo.

I just don't think it's worth the whine. Now, or in the "shot heard around the world" times.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

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Regular Reader

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:36 pm

Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 8:10 pm
Posts: 38609
Location: "Across 110th Street"

Nardi wrote:

Remember when Darvish was tipping his pitches?

Kershaw does it every postseason. The same time where a "wizard" like Maddox also became routinely average at best.

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Hatchetman

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:37 pm

Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 11:19 am
Posts: 23917
pizza_Place: Jimmy's Place

Totally disagree with RR. 80% knowing is waaaay different than 100% knowing. That's an enormous advantage in baseball.

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Nardi

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:41 pm

Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:19 pm
Posts: 29060
pizza_Place: What??

Regular Reader wrote:

man of few opinions wrote:

Really good hitters probably don't give a shit. Average hitters would be beneficiaries. I was a pitcher. On a good day, I was an average hitter. I couldn't hit a breaking ball unless I guessed right. I would LOVE to be able to not guess. And also as a pitcher, OF COURSE I'm going to whine about sign stealing.

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Regular Reader

Post subject: Re: Cheating Astros

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:43 pm

Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 8:10 pm
Posts: 38609
Location: "Across 110th Street"

Hatchetman wrote:

Totally disagree with RR. 80% knowing is waaaay different than 100% knowing. That's an enormous advantage in baseball.

We can disagree, and it may surprise you that I agree with all of the punishments meted out. But, I grew up in part a Raiders fan. Their motto was: "if you ain't cheatin', you ain't tryin." On a competitive level, that's understood in every sport. Part of the games, if you will. Especially in baseball.

But these goofs got caught. So they gotta pay. :lol: