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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:20 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Its gotta be Rust on the cross, right?

: I contemplate the moment in the garden, the idea of allowing your own crucifixion.


In the ultimate irony, Cohle will end up dying, like Jesus Christ, to save the people. He probably sacrifices himself so they can catch the guy in the act.


I was thinking about that as well. When they visit that church, he goes inside to stare at the crucifixes on the wall and the camera lingers on them for some time.


He seems fascinated by all religious symbols/iconography because they represent an ideological universe completely separate from his own.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:23 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Or maybe the daughter attended a Wellspring-like preschool? She's about the right age for it.

Given Marty's attraction to younger females, I had wondered about the possibility he had molested his daughter. Doesn't look like that's going to be part of the story, though.


The younger females have all been fully grown and I mean FULLY GROWN women.

He has always been highly protective of the young in this show.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:29 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Or maybe the daughter attended a Wellspring-like preschool? She's about the right age for it.

Given Marty's attraction to younger females, I had wondered about the possibility he had molested his daughter. Doesn't look like that's going to be part of the story, though.


The younger females have all been fully grown and I mean FULLY GROWN women.

He has always been highly protective of the young in this show.

Self loathing


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:32 pm 
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKcUdDWIHOI

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:55 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
What would be good?


I think its almost set up for failure because of the nature of the show and the wild theories it inspires.


Well, your statement assumes that wild speculation and the surprise endings they would engender are good. I don't agree.

As far as what I would like to see in the ending goes, I would prefer a conclusion that directly engages with the overarching theme of the show--the connection between individual repressed memory (as exemplified by the transgendered sex worker's decision to write his/her experience of molestation off as a dream), institutional or cultural repression of the truth (as exemplified by the unwillingness of religious authorities to confront the molestation conspiracy of which they were at least partially conscious), the perverted fantasies of the ruling class (as exemplified by the cult), and the refusal to live in a world comprised of any fantasy (as exemplified by Rust's character, a figure who disavows religion, has lived much of his adult life in a nihilistic stupor, but finally refuses to "avert his eyes" from the horror before him). In the opening episode of the series, Rust likens the town of the original crime scene to "someone's faded memory of a small town." This statement is generative of the whole show's narrative and thematic arc. The natural landscape of the bayou has been re-written, recomposed by the molestation conspiracy that is a product of a malevolent social structure. The people who inhabit coastal Louisiana are living in a nightmarishly rendered "fantasy" world that has become "reality" due to the ability of the powerful to manipulate information and perception. (This idea is underscored by the idea that Post-Katrina Louisiana is also post-apocalyptic; but we should remember that Katrina was as much or more of a social catastrophe than it was a natural disaster.) But how can such manipulation be countered? And what are the consequences of living in a reality devoid of any fantasy? These are the questions I would like to see answered in the season 1 finale.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:00 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:20 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
What would be good?


I think its almost set up for failure because of the nature of the show and the wild theories it inspires.


Well, your statement assumes that wild speculation and the surprise endings they would engender are good. I don't agree.

As far as what I would like to see in the ending goes, I would prefer a conclusion that directly engages with the overarching theme of the show--the connection between individual repressed memory (as exemplified by the transgendered sex worker's decision to write his/her experience of molestation off as a dream), institutional or cultural repression of the truth (as exemplified by the unwillingness of religious authorities to confront the molestation conspiracy of which they were at least partially conscious), the perverted fantasies of the ruling class (as exemplified by the cult), and the refusal to live in a world comprised of any fantasy (as exemplified by Rust's character, a figure who disavows religion, has lived much of his adult life in a nihilistic stupor, but finally refuses to "avert his eyes" from the horror before him). In the opening episode of the series, Rust likens the town of the original crime scene to "someone's faded memory of a small town." This statement is generative of the whole show's narrative and thematic arc. The natural landscape of the bayou has been re-written, recomposed by the molestation conspiracy that is a product of a malevolent social structure. The people who inhabit coastal Louisiana are living in a nightmarishly rendered "fantasy" world that has become "reality" due to the ability of the powerful to manipulate information and perception. (This idea is underscored by the idea that Post-Katrina Louisiana is also post-apocalyptic; but we should remember that Katrina was as much or more of a social catastrophe than it was a natural disaster.) But how can such manipulation be countered? And what are the consequences of living in a reality devoid of any fantasy? These are the questions I would like to see answered in the season 1 finale.

I see.

I think it could be a surprise and still answer those questions.

That's /\ a tall order for 60 minutes


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:35 pm 
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http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... ctive.html

The Satanic Child Sex Abuse Case That May Have Inspired ‘True Detective’

The Hosanna Church was the heart of a child sex abuse scandal shrouded in reports of devil worship and rituals with cat blood and pentagrams. Is this the case behind 'True Detective'?

Is there any monster in this world worse than man?

The residents of the small, south Louisiana town of Ponchatoula discovered in 2005 there were monsters committing unspeakable acts to children and animals. The evil was reportedly carried out inside a church.

A splinter cult reportedly formed by leaders and members of the Hosanna Church became the salacious heart of a child sex abuse scandal that rocked and shocked the community following newspaper and broadcast reports of devil worshipping and occult rituals involving animal blood and pentagrams.

Last month, Nic Pizzolatto, the South Louisiana-reared creator of HBO’s critically acclaimed pulp-thriller True Detective, told an Entertainment Weekly reporter that viewers of his show can piece together parts of the plot and
forthcoming ending by Googling the words “Satanism,” “preschool,” and “Louisiana.” Pizzolatto then said, “You'll be surprised at what you get.”

His hint points to the Hosanna Church scandal from 2005.

A staff writer at The Baton Rouge Advocate, my editors sent me to Ponchatoula to investigate, meet people, and find out whatever I could about the church and what may have happened. The area was unfamiliar to me. I covered other parishes but was sent there because the reporter who usually covered the area was out on vacation. I spent a few days in Ponchatoula, met some locals and wrote three articles for my newspaper that ran in May and June of 2005.

Everyone I met said they couldn't believe what we were all reporting.

I couldn't help but think of the cliché of neighbors telling the media that the guy who turns out to be a serial killer was always so nice, quiet, and normal. But looking back, it's unclear if members of the community I interviewed were more traumatized and disturbed by the accusations of the occult or the actual sex crimes themselves.

Back in May 2005, Tangipahoa Parish Sheriff Daniel Edwards told The Baton Rouge Advocate that members of the Ponchatoula cult accused of sexually abusing children and animals said they carried out the practices for years as part of a devil worshiping ritual involving cat blood.

“This is hard to talk about and harder to believe, but some of the suspects have told us their intention in all of this was devil worshipping,” Edwards told the Baton Rouge newspaper.

Most of the community, with a population of just more than 6,000, were in disbelief when the media reports first surfaced.

Ponchatoula was known then and still today as “America's Antique City” with its concentrated downtown area lined with antique shops. The town is also recognized internationally for its Ponchatoula Strawberry Festival.

“We are in disbelief about of all of this. Never in a million, million years would we have guessed that Louis was capable of these things. Somewhere along the line, things went wrong for him,” community member Judy Hooter said in the Advocate in 2005.

The Louis she mentioned is Louis David Lamonica.

Lamonica was 45 in 2005 when he walked into a neighboring sheriff’s office on May 16 of that year and confessed to detectives that he had sex with children and animals. Lamonica was the pastor of Hosanna Church right before it closed two years before in 2003. He went on trial in August 2008 after he was charged with four counts of aggravated rape of his sons when they were ages 11 or younger.

According to trial testimony reported by The Baton Rouge Advocate, an hour-long confession by Lamonica to detectives was played to jurors where Lamonica talked about the occult activities.

The cult began in 2000, Lamonica told deputies, with the dedication of an infant girl to Satan by placing the child in a pentagram, sacrificing a cat, and sprinkling the girl with its blood. “And then, (we) stopped worshipping God and worshiped Satan," Lamonica told the deputies in the confession.

The cult began in 2000, Lamonica told deputies, with the dedication of an infant girl to Satan by placing the child in a pentagram, sacrificing a cat, and sprinkling the girl with its blood.

He went on to tell detectives that Hosanna had two churches—one for God, in the sanctuary, and the other for Satan, in the youth room. Lamonica said his sons were selected for sexual abuse and cult members—including women—all participated.

Both of Lamonica’s sons recanted the allegations that they were raped. Lamonica was one of seven people indicted in the case, and was later convicted of the crimes and sentenced to life in prison.

All these years later, it’s still unclear if the devil worshipping and occult details that were given to detectives ever actually happened. There was no physical evidence, such as the existence of pentagrams on the floor or buried remains of sacrificed animals, presented at Lamonica’s trial.

Were stories made up by those accused to hide the truly evil acts alleged in the indictments?

District Attorney Scott Perrilloux, who prosecuted Lamonica, told The Baton Rouge Advocate in 2008 that the case was never about satanic cults.

“This case, from our perspective, had nothing to do with a church or a cult or any sort of high pressure situation. This case is about child abuse and molestation,” Perrilloux said.

The people of Ponchatoula were also left wondering if the occult had anything to do with the crimes.

“I honestly don't know if those things happened or not,” said Pat Ory, a member of the community who knew Louis David Lamonica but left Hosanna Church in 1997 when the church was called something else.

“It took a while for us to even go back to a church after all of that,” Ory said recently. Ory recalled the Hosanna Church scandal as “very stressful.”

The defense theory in the Lamonica case was that there was a cult at the church but it had nothing to do with worshiping the devil. Defense attorney Michael Thiel presented testimony at the trial that the cult was Christian but it held the members in such power that Lamonica falsely confessed.

The jury disagreed.

No one knows for sure what kind of impact this story had on Pizzolatto and how it may fit into the True Detective storyline. But the Hosanna Church scandal is a story that proves once again that the monsters we should be scared of most are the ones that live right next door.


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:52 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
Count me as a lone ranger, but I think it is just plain ignorant to continue the rampant speculation without first reading every single post made by the poster named "truede" in the link attached to this post (first sort the thread from oldest posts to new):

viewtopic.php?p=1938346#p1938346

If this is how it shakes out, a lot of fantastical theorizers are sure gonna be let down. I was one of the aforementioned, but, for some reason, I am perfectly okay with it.

He didnt see it. Episodes 1-7 went out as screeners so he impressed everybody with knowledge of episode 7 and then guessed on 8

If that was real it would be blowing up


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 12:54 am 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Q.Bovifs wrote:
Count me as a lone ranger, but I think it is just plain ignorant to continue the rampant speculation without first reading every single post made by the poster named "truede" in the link attached to this post (first sort the thread from oldest posts to new):

viewtopic.php?p=1938346#p1938346

If this is how it shakes out, a lot of fantastical theorizers are sure gonna be let down. I was one of the aforementioned, but, for some reason, I am perfectly okay with it.

He didnt see it. Episodes 1-7 went out as screeners so he impressed everybody with knowledge of episode 7 and then guessed on 8

If that was real it would be blowing up

Link?

My theory based upon a response in that thread. Look for the guy who talks about the actors guild getting 1-7

And I'd think it would be getting at least some internet play if the true ending was revealed


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 1:06 am 
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It's common knowledge that shows send out screeners for every episode besides the finale. No link is necessary to know that.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:42 am 
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Q, why do you always pick the worst possible theories and then blow up threads pertaining to those? There was like 50 replies in this thread since my last viewing and I thought "oh cool lets see what's up". Then I got a couple interesting posts from TM, a few filler posts, and 40 posts from you that were either stating the obvious or asinine. Why don't you stop talking for a while? Maybe sit the next couple of plays out.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 12:33 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
My theory based upon a response in that thread. Look for the guy who talks about the actors guild getting 1-7

And I'd think it would be getting at least some internet play if the true ending was revealed

Your "theory" seems to be entirely based on the postings of another poster named "gittlebass":

http://www.reddit.com/r/TrueDetective/c ... ne_single/

Yes, thats exactly what I said

Just my belief


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 12:34 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Q, why do you always pick the worst possible theories and then blow up threads pertaining to those? There was like 50 replies in this thread since my last viewing and I thought "oh cool lets see what's up". Then I got a couple interesting posts from TM, a few filler posts, and 40 posts from you that were either stating the obvious or asinine. Why don't you stop talking for a while? Maybe sit the next couple of plays out.

He buried the alleged spoliers and told everyone not to look, thern got upset no one looked


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:50 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Q, why do you always pick the worst possible theories and then blow up threads pertaining to those? There was like 50 replies in this thread since my last viewing and I thought "oh cool lets see what's up". Then I got a couple interesting posts from TM, a few filler posts, and 40 posts from you that were either stating the obvious or asinine. Why don't you stop talking for a while? Maybe sit the next couple of plays out.

He buried the alleged spoliers and told everyone not to look, thern got upset no one looked

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I rarely root for such things, but I am now rooting hard for this truede dude to be right so you can feel quite dumb for challenging MY AUTHORITAH!

Is what I said not true? Did you not bury the spoilers and put warnings up and then call people ignorant for not discussing it?


I did look, I just think its probably not legit. We shall see


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 7:17 pm 
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Is it him?

Second from the right....
http://i.imgur.com/xBTNA4s.jpg

and then in the center.
http://i.imgur.com/jQqNPuI.png


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 7:19 pm 
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I watched the first episode and didn't really like it.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 7:23 pm 
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Nas wrote:
I watched the first episode and didn't really like it.


Everyone's tastes are different, but man, I highly recommend watching the remaining episodes.


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 7:27 pm 
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Matches Malone wrote:
Nas wrote:
I watched the first episode and didn't really like it.


Everyone's tastes are different, but man, I highly recommend watching the remaining episodes.


I will eventually. That's why I won't read this thread.

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https://youtu.be/R6e4ruziZBI?si=1G4W1vbh0eGQuHfU


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 7:49 pm 
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I firmly believe "Lost" ruined it for every show. Now everyone wants to think they're smart by overanalyzing every little aspect of a show. Or they're just bored. Well, it's not just TV. It's HBO.

It's actually anything that people want to waste their time fan fictioning to death thinking that they're nancy drew. I used to be on the IMDB message boards way back between 2003-2005. Holy shit, it was bad.

I don't even have to read half this thread to know it's at best conjecture. Jesus christ, guys.

I need a Lone Star.


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:05 pm 
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I do believe there is a big indictment on Catholicism, religion, and Louisiana--to TM's point...which is more coherent but still a bit overarching.

See, Louisiana is ruled by Catholicism. Parishes rule the districts. My mawmaw's house was condemned and St. Bernard Parish had control over the whole area. The idea of a state-wide conspiracy dealing with religion and politicians is what I think the writer's going for (he's from there).

We all know how it works. In fact I think the saying goes something like...If you can buy the politics in New Orleans, you can drink the water too.

it's like the anti "Treme". "Treme Detective". There could be something to Marty's family and the sexual repression cult shit that's going on. A family link? Uhm...well, if that's what happens...that's kind of contrived.

I don't want a Deus Ex Machina here. The setup has been too good.

Oh on a side note...every chick has been hot, and every sex scene has been very well handled. Topped with Rust fucking Marty's wife. Wow. Amazing.

And now back to your regularly scheduled nut shit theories.


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:23 pm 
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WZ wrote: stop speculating guys. Next post, WZ speculates on what the show is about. Classic. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:26 pm 
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Sometimes I think I lost it. Othertimes I think I just mainlined into the secrets of the whole fuckin' universe...


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 12:05 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Is what I said not true? Did you not bury the spoilers and put warnings up and then call people ignorant for not discussing it?

I did look, I just think its probably not legit. We shall see

Fuck that, the spoilers are pretty fucking huge, so I set it in red letters so people would know what they were getting into.

Indeed we shall see - but I will not be on to post until later tomorrow nite. :D :D :D

Aren't you new to this show? Sure seems like it.

It seems like I'm new to this show? What a were thing to say.


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 12:12 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
Rogers Pork Brain I am going to be UP YOUR GIGGITY with SHINE-BLOCKING charges if these predictions turn out to be true.

I'm sorry your post didn't get the attention you had hoped for. Dont blame me, I read and discussed the spoilers. I just hope they aren't true because it sounds bad.

Not sure why you turn everything into "Nobody gives me enough attention"

Anyway, if your spoiler proves correct, I will commend you on finding spoilers to a TV show


Happy Finale Day, Gentlemen


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 1:12 pm 
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W_Z wrote:
I firmly believe "Lost" ruined it for every show. Now everyone wants to think they're smart by overanalyzing every little aspect of a show.


I think that started well before Lost. How about Twin Peaks and then The X-Files.

I have to agree with RPB that the ending described in the spoiler Panther posted the link to would be less than satisfying. After all the great dialogue and the feeling of a menacing presence hanging over the entire world of the show, tying it up with a Die Hard style shootout would be a huge disappointment, regardless of whether Cohle and/or Hart live or die.

Also, once the writer's vision is committed to tape, his opinions about what happened off-screen or after the camera stopped are no more important than anyone else's. He had his chance to make anything clear that he wanted. If he didn't, it's up to the viewer to interpret things for himself. RPB thinks Tony Soprano died in the diner. Some other people don't. No one is right and no one is wrong. And even if David Chase came out tomorrow and said Tony was shot by Members Only, that doesn't make it true. He had the opportunity to make that occur and he didn't. for better or worse, it's open ended.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 2:12 pm 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
I think that started well before Lost. How about Twin Peaks and then The X-Files.


all 3 of those shows are about mystical things and revolve around mysteries that are unexplained. "true detective" isn't at all like that. it's a crime show. it would be like breaking down "nypd blue". while nick pizzolatto injects some symbolism in the show and there are some contrasts that are on purpose to interpret...it's not like he's throwing wild ideas out there to contemplate. it's a pretty straight forward show, actually.

Quote:
Also, once the writer's vision is committed to tape, his opinions about what happened off-screen or after the camera stopped are no more important than anyone else's. He had his chance to make anything clear that he wanted. If he didn't, it's up to the viewer to interpret things for himself. RPB thinks Tony Soprano died in the diner. Some other people don't. No one is right and no one is wrong. And even if David Chase came out tomorrow and said Tony was shot by Members Only, that doesn't make it true. He had the opportunity to make that occur and he didn't. for better or worse, it's open ended.


david chase did that on purpose. he didn't know how to end it so he threw that out there because he knew he couldn't do something predictable since there was so much hype surrounding how it was going to end. he didn't have much choice but it was still a cop out.

the show should not have been more than 4 seasons, which was his original intention. he got greedy.

years ago i may have had fun with the crazy theories. i'm blaming all the semesters of film class i took for ruining it for me personally.


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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 2:40 pm 
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I like this show, but I hope the ending sucks cause every post in this thread annoys the shit out of me.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 2:49 pm 
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Q.Bovifs wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
W_Z wrote:
I firmly believe "Lost" ruined it for every show. Now everyone wants to think they're smart by overanalyzing every little aspect of a show.


I think that started well before Lost. How about Twin Peaks and then The X-Files.

I have to agree with RPB that the ending described in the spoiler Panther posted the link to would be less than satisfying. After all the great dialogue and the feeling of a menacing presence hanging over the entire world of the show, tying it up with a Die Hard style shootout would be a huge disappointment, regardless of whether Cohle and/or Hart live or die.

Also, once the writer's vision is committed to tape, his opinions about what happened off-screen or after the camera stopped are no more important than anyone else's. He had his chance to make anything clear that he wanted. If he didn't, it's up to the viewer to interpret things for himself. RPB thinks Tony Soprano died in the diner. Some other people don't. No one is right and no one is wrong. And even if David Chase came out tomorrow and said Tony was shot by Members Only, that doesn't make it true. He had the opportunity to make that occur and he didn't. for better or worse, it's open ended.

Why would you be disappointed?

The spoiler didn't describe a "shootout" ending anyhow. Plus, the producers have been trying to calm people down about the ending not being something otherworldly spectacular anyhow for the past two or so weeks.

To any who would be disappointed, I say this: Take off the now-come-hipster Mardi Gras mask, delete the 16 episodes of 'Check, Please!' from your DVR, and just appreciate the journey. Enjoy whatever happens to these characters.


Shootout, "battle", whatever you want to call it. The show set a high bar in the earlier episodes. To have it end up like a glorified episode of CSI would be awful.

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 Post subject: Re: True Detective
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 2:57 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
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I enjoy the speculation. I don't think people do it to sound smart. I mean correctly predicting a TV show doesn't signify intelligence, it likely signifies a person who watches too much TV



Zack, I gotta disagree with the straight forward thing. This show has been littered with red herring type stuff. The writer can act shocked about the theories all he wants but he wrote it that way. At one point they had Harts character thinking Rust was in on it


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