Bulls -1 (They're due for a win. At home. Devin Booker's big toe is no bueno.)
Wolves -6 (At home. No John Wall to guard.)
Nuggets +2 (Rudy Gobert and Joe Johnson are both out.)
Bucks @ Kings -198

Yeah, I knew it was a big if at the time. Oh well, that prediction wasn't working out either way

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I love that his dumbass son was the one who did it but Doc tried to blame Lonzo

Thunder getting crushed in Orlando right now
This team is trash

This is the portion of the show where I should be using "too early" excuse. Extremely convenient.

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Lonzo coming alive in the 3rd! This is an entertaining game

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

What does Billy Donovan do to earn an NBA check?

I'm finally starting to get back into the Association, but I'm having a hard time with this one.

_________________
There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

Supposedly Russell loves him and he was a big reason why Russell resigned for 5 more years. I think he’s a shit coach but that alone justifies his salary if true.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

You'd think that he'd at least find a way to find George in his homecoming game, especially with Russ and Melo shooting for shit, again

_________________
There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

Yeah but the Pacers are playing well this year. I’ve also not need a fan of George since he came back from injury. Just not the same guy. The people(ltg) saying he was better than Butler last year were ridiculous.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

He is better. If he makes the All Star team you will say it doesn't matter. Your eye test stinks right about now. Far too many misses. May be time to regroup.

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Dude stop putting so much stock into the value of all star teams. All NBA teams isnt even a great test but Butler will get more votes for that this year too. He's gonna have better stats. Butler is clearly a better player right now than George. Has been since George's injury.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Let's see. You had him better than Giannis, Kyrie, and Cousins. You were wrong about each. He isn't better than any of them. I'm comfortable with thinking he isn't better than George.

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https://www.si.com/nba/2017/12/14/denve ... acebook_si



King Jokic

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Jokic current PPG avg is similar to Robin Lopez. Lopez bum. Jokic Great. This is the culmination of what we like to call in the game a bad run.

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You judge players solely based on ppg? Yikes!

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Actually I don't. If we were to actually break down their games it would become apparent that you either A have Jokic overrated or B. underrate Lopez. Jokic is a good player. He isn't a great player and passing is only one aspect of the game and I don't overrate it either. He is a weak defender. Towns level bad and he doesn't have gaudy rebounding numbers either. He is solid but He isn't taking teams anywhere. Denver's talent is pretty good too.

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Jokic was 8th in the entire NBA in PER last season. He was 9th in the entire NBA in WS/48. He was 5th in Box Plus/Minus. He was 9th in the NBA in VORP.

Advanced metrics can be flawed, but even if we allow that he's not THAT good, he's clearly a great player.

Jokic averages 16.9 rebounds per 100 possessions so far for his career. Lopez averages 12.2. It's hilarious that you are even attempting to compare them as players.

It's ok that you didn't/don't know how good Jokic is. Most casual fans don't.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Who cares what he avg is per whatever. He has never played 30 minutes per game at any point of his career. That is why I don't go with advanced metrics that often. I probably could find an advanced metric which states that Frank Mason jr. is better than Kyrie Irving. Earlier in the year one person argued that Al Horford was better than Kyrie Irving. It was due to advanced metrics. There is an overreliance on that stuff. If he is great he will make All Star teams. His impact will be known throughout the league. He isn't a dominant player. He is a good player. Its not a diss either.

I don't overrate guys. I like his game but he isn't in that class with the truly great bigs in the NBA.

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LTG dismissing per 100 possessions is the most LTG thing ever. How is that an advanced metric? Can you count that high?

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Can you have an actual basketball discussion without resorting to statistics?

I dismissed Per 36 in the other post. Are you able to comprehend? I doubt it.

He is arguing with me about whether he is better than Lopez. So? I'm not the one saying that Lopez is a great player. Lopez is a decent Center in my book. He isn't a bum. Nerlens Noel is a bum. That's who FF should be letting have it. SHould have cut bait with that a while ago. Okafor has been and will be a much better player going forward.

ability to determine whether a guy can play or not really isn't a strong suit of yours so its rather futile to discuss such things with you. You'll simply find the latest John Hollinger posting and cite as if you have discovered a cure for cancer.

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Per 100 possessions is not the same as per 36.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

i know what Per 100 possession happens to be. You're comparing his to Lopez. So what? Lets compare him to other great centers since you place him in the class of other great centers. You are trying to flip it as if I'm saying Lopez is better. I'm not. That would make you for lack of a better term a liar.


Let's compare him to other top 5 Centers and see how he stacks up. Demarcus Cousins who I seem to remember you dissing obliterates him numbers wise and is also a better defender.

I've never said that Lopez was great. I think he is solid though. He isn't a bum. Nerlens Noel is however a bum

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You compared him to a bum like Lopez, not me.

Cousins is atrocious defensively and yes, Jokic’s stats compare favorably to his. Cousins is having by far the best year of his career so he’s slightly ahead this year but Jokic beat him across the board last year BPM, PER, WS/48, VORP, etc.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Cousins will always be a much better scorer and Jokic has to play more minutes also. 29 minutes a game for a guy considered "great" is rather low.

Contrary to popular belief the most important aspect of the game is scoring also. There are other aspects obviously but scoring is the most important factor in basketball. If you are going to be "great" without being a great scorer then you'd better be able to be dominant in the other areas. Jokic's assist totals aren't all that outstanding either. They are good for a Center but there are a few other Centers that put up those totals. Cousins exceeds them. His Rebound totals are good not great. Where is the there?

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I agree he should be playing a few more min per game, but he's been banged up this year and just became a starter last December.

You do realize though that playing lower minutes affects other per game stats, right? So no, Cousins is not better when it comes to assists. Jokic is at 7.7 per 100 possessions and Cousins is at 6.9. Jokic's assist % is 24.6% this year, 24% for his career. Cousins is at 23.6% this year and 17.8% for his career.
'
I agree scoring is most important, and Jokic is a more efficient scorer than Cousins. Cousins TS% is .577, Jokic is .609. Jokic could easily score 20+ ppg if he wanted to. I like that he makes his teammates better(Cousins does not). That's how you become the centerpiece of an explosive offense, which is exactly what Jokic is.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Cousins rebounds per 100 possessions: 16.9
Jokic rebounds per 100 possessions: 17.8

LTG's conclusion: Cousins is a FAR SUPERIOR rebounder.


Also, to be clear, I like Cousins. You remember wrong if you remember me dissing him.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Is now a good time to point out that Embiid, loved by LTG, only plays 30 minutes a game. Yet Jokic is penalized playing 29 minutes.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Jeff Van Gundy just said Donovan coaching this OK3 team is “a mirror image” of Brown coaching the awful, rebuilding Sixer teams of the past couple years

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

_________________
I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.