Elway falls into the category of overrated in my book but I certainly don’t think he wasn’t great. He was most certainly lucky though considering he was along for the ride on the SB or he wouldn’t even be considered as good as Marino.

_________________
“How do you get to be president and you’re stupid?” Donald J Trump - 4/10/25
When a clown moves into a palace, he doesn't become a king. The palace turns into a circus. - Turkish Proverb

Cmon Zippy , this is Jordan hand check stuff. If Fouts , Stabler, Bradshaw and most of those guys with by today’s standards bad completion percentage iplayed in today’s game they would light it up. Defensive backs were allowed to mug those receivers back in the day you know that. Conversely, Cutler certainly would’ve thrown avhell of a lot more interceptions had he played when those guys did.

_________________
Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

Did you just start on the last page?

_________________
“How do you get to be president and you’re stupid?” Donald J Trump - 4/10/25
When a clown moves into a palace, he doesn't become a king. The palace turns into a circus. - Turkish Proverb

Aikman was definitely a good QB. Not sure what some of the people here disagreeing are on about.



As others have mentioned, the stats you see today were much harder to come by back in the day due to defensive rules being much different.


Which should make a guy like Steve Young (for example) look more impressive to some in all honesty..

_________________
If the rule you followed lead you to this, of what use was the rule?

As for Dilfers take.. I don’t put too much stock in it. If he’s going to compare what he went through early to what’s going on now with JF.. meh. The only thing I’ll agree on right now is the talent level of Justin Fields, he’s got a great amount of ‘ability’.. but we’ve been down that road with Cutler too and that didn’t work out too well.


One other ‘excuse’ I’ll allow for Fields is that there really isn’t much help at all around him. The O-line is terrible at pass blocking and the receivers are mostly guys who will struggle year to year to make a roster. But still.. some of the bad we’re seeing is Fields just being bad all on his own.

_________________
If the rule you followed lead you to this, of what use was the rule?

I have often stated that at his prime, Steve young might have been the best QB I have ever seen. It didn’t last for 10+ years or anything that would catapult him into GOAT territory, but for five or so years in his prime he was outrageously good.

He had a couple seasons in the 90’s that would be considered a great season by today’s standards.. pretty crazy when you look back at it. People are too used to the inflated stats that defensive rule changes have brought on in today’s game.

_________________
If the rule you followed lead you to this, of what use was the rule?

The thing I remember most about him is his accuracy and completion percentage. His completion percentages back then were outrageous for the time. And it wasn’t just screen passes.

Aikman definitely had some luck. That offensive line (pre salary cap) was ridiculous. I believe at one point all starting five were pro bowlers. No way you assemble a starting five like that in the modern salary cap era.

Both of these guys seem oily, but they also often make fair points in their analyses. Dilfer is clearly more confident in Fields attaining elite status than Jenkins is, and that conclusion stems from his past relationship with Fields. His opinion therefore seems shaped more by having worked with/observed Fields as a younger player than it is by Fields' performance in the NFL. Does Dilfer have a good track record in predicting the future success of young quarterbacks? He talks a good game, but there are plenty of reasons to doubt him.

_________________

You should get that brain injury checked out. I'm concerned.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I think Nas and I are the only Elway guys, but I watched a lot of him growing up because of where I lived (KC market), and watched him drag teams into the Super Bowl. The NFC was just better all around but Elway was masterful in his ability to spread the ball around and make plays.

He earned the right to be pulled into winning those last 2.

Elway guy here. He had a game that 1st Super Bowl

_________________

I'm old and most of my memory died with my wife, but I could swear that before "The Drive" Elway was a guy that could be counted on to throw a bad pick at the worst time. He seemingly saved his worst performances for the biggest moments until he had Terrell Davis. Again, I could be wrong.

_________________
"I give you my word as a Biden"

Elways first super bowl will always be my favorite that’s for sure.

Well said!

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I watched Aikman, not Bradshaw.. but it was never good to throw interceptions and always good to score TDs for as long as the game was invented..he was benched a couple times.[/quote]
How do you feel about Favre? Stabler? Jay Cutler? Dan Fouts?[/quote]

Great
Don't know
Sucked
Great[/quote]You state that throwing ints was never good but Favre is the all time leader in that category. The great Fouts threw for 254 tds but also 242 ints with a 59% completion percentage. Cutler threw for 227 tds with only 160 ints with a 62% cp.[/quote]

Cutler wouldnt last 2 seasons in the old nfl, I really dont give a shit about completion percentage, Guys that throw downfield will haveca lower % then (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky who cant throw downfield.

_________________

I grudgingly finally gave the GOAT title to Brady. I loved Drew Brees and wish that he had some good defenses or he might have been the GOAT. I think that one of the worst decisions ever by the Chicago Bears was not signing Brees when he was a free agent after his Charger years and getting hurt. I think about Brees playing on the Bears teams when they had the great defenses. Wishful dreaming.

_________________
An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

Personally I would like them to allow both the defender and the receiver to hand fight for the ball in the air. To me before the ball is in the air, the receiver should not be grabbed but let them both be able to fight for the ball equally. Right now there is way too much power given to the officials to decide football games with very iffy pass interference calls on the defense where the offensive player is the one really interfering with the defenders right to the ball.

_________________
An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

I agree with you. Aikman was a good quarterback who didn't make many mistakes. However, he had luxuries of an amazing team around him like you said along with the fact that there were also all-pros on the Cowboys defense also.

_________________
An Ode to the Texas man who shot an Antifa terrorist:

Oh, he might have went on livin'
But he made one fatal slip
When he tried to match the Ranger
With the big iron on his hip

Another thing to remember - a great o-line is a great advantage for sure BUT a great QB who makes quick decisions and is accurate can make an o-line look good. It’s a 2-way street. I’m not hating on the cowboys oline of the 90’s, it was obviously great but having a great quarterback with great pocket presence who makes quick decisions and unloads the ball makes o-lines look pretty good as well.

Stop it! That was an offense that, at times, had 8 pro bowl/all pro players. Stan Humphries would have won multiple Super Bowls with those teams.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Stop what? i agree, it was an all-time great line. but to say Aikman sucked and was simply propped up by a good line like some are insinuating is ridiculous. the line was lucky to have Aikman, Aikman was lucky to have Irvin, they were all lucky to have Emmitt, the offense was lucky to have a great defense. It was a great team with great players all over the place who all came together at the right time and place.

Jay Novackeck, all pro
Michael Irvin , HOF
Alvin Harper, pro bowler

Beyond loaded!!! Lol

I'd consider myself an Elway guy, but man....it's really hard to put him in the all-time top 10 list. I can't do it.

_________________

No one said he sucked. I simply said he was overrated. There is no question that the talent around him propped him up. You could insert Stan Humphries or a league average quarterback in that lineup, and they still win multiple championships.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

LOL Alvin Harper. what an all-time great, you should have stopped at Irvin. I’m pretty sure Novacek isn’t going in the hall of fame any time soon either. He had a nice run with Dallas, no doubt, but he hardly propped up Troy Aikman. Those cowboys teams were great and were loaded with HOF talent, don’t contaminate it by dropping those names.

Someone specifically said Aikman sucked earlier in the thread, and he is the one my remarks are pointed at.

I missed that. My bad. Phil Simms or Troy Aikman? Jim Kelly or Troy Aikman? Vinny Testaverde or Troy Aikman? Jeff George or Troy Aikman?

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I’d put Troy and Phil on pretty equal footing, with the slight edge to Troy because he’s more accurate. Kelly might be a little more talented but he fell apart in some big moments so that’s a toss up imo.. Troy was flat out better than Jeff and Vinny tho.. George had a more ‘talented’ arm (one if the best ever imo).. but he could never put it all together.

_________________
If the rule you followed lead you to this, of what use was the rule?